Mortal Kombat: 3D vs 2D

I personally Like the 2D gameplay alot better, I think future MK games should be 3D but with 2D gameplay.

I personaly think that the 3D works really well, i think the formula they would need is probably " The Mk 2 Dark and sinister feeling (make it dark & gritty) + Style/combo mechanic from MK: DA " they dont need to give all the characters 3 fighting styles, if they make 1 Weapon style, and 1 standard ( unique ) style for each character i'd be pleased.
IMO i think it was very refreshing when i first popped in MK:DA, i think every one liked the way the game was, and to be honest as time, and technology goes forward, i think there's going to be a very little chance of a UMK remake into 2.5D.

BTW i'm new here, nice to meet everybody! happy to see so many Mk Fans! d:D yay
 
All the MK games ran at around 30fps on the old arcade system, and now the mark for most games are 60fps to get fluid motion. Sure they'll reuse frames, but it's just to make the game look and animate smooth.

I haven't played MK1 in a while, but I'm pretty sure MKII and UMK3 ran at 60Hz. In fact, the only fighters I remember that ran at 30Hz were VF1 and Toshinden.

Motion isn't really the main concern here since unlike racers, the speed of animations won't have as much judder on screen. Control responsiveness is much smoother at 60Hz, particularly with frame sensitive games like Tekken and VF. I forget the exact stats but Gamasutra has had a feature up a while ago.
 
And by "real" you mean "set in fantasy universe where normal-sized men can lift whole marble columns" that real? If you want real look at a shooter like Rainbow Six or Modern Warfare 2. But in truth, I would prefer the stylized HD of GoW3 to a shooter. Real is never what people actually want. They just think it is.
 
Since this thread got brought back up I'd like to try get a clarification going here. People love to throw around 2D vs 3D a lot without really detailing what they want to be in 2D or 3D. There are many aspects to a game that can be 2D or 3D, not just "the game."

MK9 will be a "3D rendering engine" just like every MK since MK4. The characters will be composed of 3D modeled characters, there will be no 2D sprites used in games prior to MK4. It's overly costly, takes a lot more time and doesn't scale very well to do digital image capture of the characters. If you want classic sprites like the 90s, well then I'd stick to those games as it's not going back that way EVER. The game will be in the 3D, and will be running on Unreal Engine 3 just as MKvsDC did.

Now with that said, Mortal Kombat vs DC Universe was the closest post-MK4 game to move back towards a "2D gameplay engine" it moved even more control away from the side-step ability and relegated that to having to hold a button to change your 3D position by side-stepping. In my experience the side-stepping adds too much complexity to the gameplay of a fast paced fighting game. It would be in the team's best interest to move to a strict 2D gameplay similar to the prior games, but while maintaining a very excellent 3D rendering engine.

More and more games are moving back to this model, look at Street Fighter IV and the New Super Mario Bros series. Both are very flexible 3D engines with accessible 2D gameplay. It makes it easy to play and pick up, without getting confused on how you move around.

After the success of SFIV I'd be surprised to see MK9 keep a free moving model, I barely used any of the MKvsDC side step functions while playing and enjoyed it just fine that way.

.

I agree with this also side stepping was just annoying
 
Midway FAILED at 3-D Mortal Kombat because it was unfamiliar territory. My point: Soul Calibur is the STANDARD for weapons based 3-D combat. Tekken or DoA is the STANDARD for Hand to hand based 3-D combat.

Midway was trying to compete with both of these two formulas that have been refined and perfected before Midway even started flirting with 3-D.

Simply put, the combat play in the 3-D Mortal Kombat games were choppy and could NOT compete with the counterparts of that kind of gameplay. If they wanted to play that game, if they wanted to compete, what they SHOULD have done was pay attention to some VERY comprehensive 3-D fighting gameplay models such as Tekken and Soul Calibur.

Honestly, I was excited as hell when I heard of MK:DA because it was supposed to have everything I loved about 3-D fighting games in one package with my FAVORITE characters from any fighting game. But they executed it poorly. They didn't try to learn from the experts when it comes to 3-D fighting, they just mashed it all together and threw in some gimmicks in hopes that it could compete.

Seriously, how bad would it actually be to have a Mortal Kombat that could hold its own in the 3-D fighting game arena? I don't think it'd be that hard to implement a very refined 3-D fighting game experience.

I'll just down right say it... If Midway did some blatant 3-D fighting copy pasta where the weapons combat was a carbon copy of Soul Calibur's and the hand to hand was a carbon copy of VF or Tekken, and coupled up with a seamless transition between the styles, you would have had a champion in the 3-D fighter market. Because even though that would have been a blatant copy, the game play WOULD NOT HAVE FAILED and considering that the fatalities, special moves, MK aesthetic was intact, they would not have suffered at all on the markets. They would have dominated.

Netherrealm Studios needs to take a lesson from those heavy hitters if they want to compete in the 3-D fighter market again. But if not, go back to the 2-D fighting of UMK3 with heavily intensive 3-D graphics that pushes the consoles to the limit. Either way, they wouldn't fail if they'd just stop thinking that gimmicks such as "rage kombat, klose kombat, and free fall kombat" can even compete with the other fighters. Hell, even the DBZ games are gimmicky like the MK ones, but they even managed to do better.

Midway has some amazing ideas. Some of the best I've ever seen when it comes to fighting games. But good god, they can't execute them to save their life.
 
And by "real" you mean "set in fantasy universe where normal-sized men can lift whole marble columns" that real? If you want real look at a shooter like Rainbow Six or Modern Warfare 2. But in truth, I would prefer the stylized HD of GoW3 to a shooter. Real is never what people actually want. They just think it is.

When I meant real, I meant the graphics not the gameplay or the fantasy magic. Of course MK will have magic. What I mean is the graphics to be so real that there should be no glitches into them what so ever. I don't want pieces of character's clothing or hair to go through their neck or othe body parts when it's not suppose to be that way.
 
Midway FAILED at 3-D Mortal Kombat because it was unfamiliar territory. My point: Soul Calibur is the STANDARD for weapons based 3-D combat. Tekken or DoA is the STANDARD for Hand to hand based 3-D combat.

Midway was trying to compete with both of these two formulas that have been refined and perfected before Midway even started flirting with 3-D.

Simply put, the combat play in the 3-D Mortal Kombat games were choppy and could NOT compete with the counterparts of that kind of gameplay. If they wanted to play that game, if they wanted to compete, what they SHOULD have done was pay attention to some VERY comprehensive 3-D fighting gameplay models such as Tekken and Soul Calibur.

Honestly, I was excited as hell when I heard of MK:DA because it was supposed to have everything I loved about 3-D fighting games in one package with my FAVORITE characters from any fighting game. But they executed it poorly. They didn't try to learn from the experts when it comes to 3-D fighting, they just mashed it all together and threw in some gimmicks in hopes that it could compete.

Seriously, how bad would it actually be to have a Mortal Kombat that could hold its own in the 3-D fighting game arena? I don't think it'd be that hard to implement a very refined 3-D fighting game experience.

I'll just down right say it... If Midway did some blatant 3-D fighting copy pasta where the weapons combat was a carbon copy of Soul Calibur's and the hand to hand was a carbon copy of VF or Tekken, and coupled up with a seamless transition between the styles, you would have had a champion in the 3-D fighter market. Because even though that would have been a blatant copy, the game play WOULD NOT HAVE FAILED and considering that the fatalities, special moves, MK aesthetic was intact, they would not have suffered at all on the markets. They would have dominated.

Netherrealm Studios needs to take a lesson from those heavy hitters if they want to compete in the 3-D fighter market again. But if not, go back to the 2-D fighting of UMK3 with heavily intensive 3-D graphics that pushes the consoles to the limit. Either way, they wouldn't fail if they'd just stop thinking that gimmicks such as "rage kombat, klose kombat, and free fall kombat" can even compete with the other fighters. Hell, even the DBZ games are gimmicky like the MK ones, but they even managed to do better.

Midway has some amazing ideas. Some of the best I've ever seen when it comes to fighting games. But good god, they can't execute them to save their life.

Having been disappointed by one of my favourite long time series recently due to the same old problems the MK team are experiencing, I don't know. A direction is where you start (Sonic was different every damn game) and you develope it that way. MK at LEAST got that down, they got a direction from MK:DA and went with it. But now they've broken from that direction, who knows where they're going. By the looks of MK vs. Dc, a compremise between 2d and 3d.
 
Midway FAILED at 3-D Mortal Kombat because it was unfamiliar territory. My point: Soul Calibur is the STANDARD for weapons based 3-D combat. Tekken or DoA is the STANDARD for Hand to hand based 3-D combat.

Midway was trying to compete with both of these two formulas that have been refined and perfected before Midway even started flirting with 3-D.

Simply put, the combat play in the 3-D Mortal Kombat games were choppy and could NOT compete with the counterparts of that kind of gameplay. If they wanted to play that game, if they wanted to compete, what they SHOULD have done was pay attention to some VERY comprehensive 3-D fighting gameplay models such as Tekken and Soul Calibur.

Honestly, I was excited as hell when I heard of MK:DA because it was supposed to have everything I loved about 3-D fighting games in one package with my FAVORITE characters from any fighting game. But they executed it poorly. They didn't try to learn from the experts when it comes to 3-D fighting, they just mashed it all together and threw in some gimmicks in hopes that it could compete.

Seriously, how bad would it actually be to have a Mortal Kombat that could hold its own in the 3-D fighting game arena? I don't think it'd be that hard to implement a very refined 3-D fighting game experience.

I'll just down right say it... If Midway did some blatant 3-D fighting copy pasta where the weapons combat was a carbon copy of Soul Calibur's and the hand to hand was a carbon copy of VF or Tekken, and coupled up with a seamless transition between the styles, you would have had a champion in the 3-D fighter market. Because even though that would have been a blatant copy, the game play WOULD NOT HAVE FAILED and considering that the fatalities, special moves, MK aesthetic was intact, they would not have suffered at all on the markets. They would have dominated.

Netherrealm Studios needs to take a lesson from those heavy hitters if they want to compete in the 3-D fighter market again. But if not, go back to the 2-D fighting of UMK3 with heavily intensive 3-D graphics that pushes the consoles to the limit. Either way, they wouldn't fail if they'd just stop thinking that gimmicks such as "rage kombat, klose kombat, and free fall kombat" can even compete with the other fighters. Hell, even the DBZ games are gimmicky like the MK ones, but they even managed to do better.

Midway has some amazing ideas. Some of the best I've ever seen when it comes to fighting games. But good god, they can't execute them to save their life.

Good post, er rant. :mrgreen:
 
I think we all know the score. Style wise, Mortal Kombat has the best fighting game universe, period and with their gore aspect and fatalities, MK always stands to be a threat to other fighting games. BUT, we all know that it only brings it so far. I think we all feel that MK has the potential to be number one. But it doesn't seem to pull it off and we KNOW it can do better...
 
Im one of the fans that hated everthing after mk mythologies. When they went 3D i was more disappointed everytime. I mean how could I like MKT more than MKA? I only liked MKT cuz it had every person and stage. MKA had EVERYONE, and it's my least fav.

Of course MKA has it's own set off issue (Kreate a Fatality, wow either they got really lazy or were running out of ideas. Quan Chi's "neck stretch")

The 3d games always made the fighters feel so "heavy", boxed up and "blocky". My friend would joke how muscular they were, and he was right.

The ninjas were always cut up (Daniel Pesina) now they look like WWE wrestlers.

The completely said **** the jump kick and that was one of the main aspect of 2d mk's. Jump kicks set off juggle combos. THAT was a big dissappointment.
The started getting back to jump kicks/punches in MK VS DC, I think they got a grasp on some of the main mistakes.

But I'm execting MK9 to be an extension of MK vs Dc, which should be enjoyable. But I can't see them going 2.5D. Boon seem to just refuse to "step backward".

I wish they would go the digitized actor route one more time, and dress em up like the MK2 commercial, in HD, with new technology. That be my perfect MK.
 
I think we all know the score. Style wise, Mortal Kombat has the best fighting game universe, period and with their gore aspect and fatalities, MK always stands to be a threat to other fighting games. BUT, we all know that it only brings it so far. I think we all feel that MK has the potential to be number one. But it doesn't seem to pull it off and we KNOW it can do better...

You are totally right! We haven't seen the creators try hard enough to make MK number 1 but I think they can get there.

@reptilesmile: You're ideas would be nice too. I mean who needs MK to be 2.5D when it can be 3D like God of War 3.
 
Mortal Kombat will NEVER be the #1 fighter. It has the best story, but that doesn't make it #1.

Street Fighter will always remain the #1 fighter. Period.

Tekken certainly and comfortably occupies the #2 spot.
 
Mortal Kombat will NEVER be the #1 fighter. It has the best story, but that doesn't make it #1.

Street Fighter will always remain the #1 fighter. Period.

Tekken certainly and comfortably occupies the #2 spot.

Unfortunately, I agree. SF will always be the father of fighters, and Tekken will always have Eddy Gordo (best character in all fighting games). Those two things make SF and Tekken the #1 and #2. MK has a lot of things, but unless it has a monumental original idea which changes everyones' ideas on fighting games, it really won't come out of the #3 slot, all it will be known as is "Street Fighter's gory cousin".
 
Unfortunately, I agree. SF will always be the father of fighters, and Tekken will always have Eddy Gordo (best character in all fighting games). Those two things make SF and Tekken the #1 and #2. MK has a lot of things, but unless it has a monumental original idea which changes everyones' ideas on fighting games, it really won't come out of the #3 slot, all it will be known as is "Street Fighter's gory cousin".

I guess I'll have to agree with you guys for now. I just hope that changes and that MK makes it to the #1 spot someday. But to me, I really like MK better than the other 2 games due to its gory content.
 
MK is no SF gory cousin, come on, I like MK and 2d and 3d are good and MK9 is suppose to look different than SFIV so hope looks realistic and bad@ss
 
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