iViTal
Active member
Damn, I can't give you the silent treatment then :L
New Tier List / MU Chart
- Thread starter n9195v
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Damn, I can't give you the silent treatment then :L
Critical-Limit
New member
I don't think you need a JC video, you know what you need to do. What your lacking is experience with it, and understanding your opponents patterns.
iViTal
Active member
Get out of my head, you're so right :[
It's not everyday that I fight a good Cage that mixes up his frame traps well, and I really want to learn how to defend against that so it doesn't make the Mileena v cage match up looks like it's 1-9.
Critical-Limit
New member
Actually let me test your knowledge real quick Vital.
Lets say Johnny cage hits your block with 1,1
What do you do after that?
Lets say Johnny cage hits your block with 1,1
What do you do after that?
Critical-Limit
New member
well 1,1 is 0 block advantage of his 1,1,F1 is +3
You could try to poke after 1,1 if you think he's gonna do a F3, right after. But since you don't know for sure after 1,1. your right I think it's best to wait.
iViTal
Active member
Looking over his frame data, The man is either safe or has advantage on all of his Normals.. Even a blocked Sweep gives him frame advantage.. :|
I remember you telling me to wait for the third hit of his F3,3,B3 string.. The third his is the Overhead and not the last kick that hits high, right?
Flagg
New member
Yeah, I do think Scorpion is gimmicky. Slips said himself, it's basically a flip of the coin when he commits himself. He blows you up or he gets blown up. Seriously, what kind of strategy is that?
If Slips commited to Ermac or Smoke, that would be epic. But he wont. He's not going to Evo, but I wonder if he'll even carry on playing the game from now on.
If Slips commited to Ermac or Smoke, that would be epic. But he wont. He's not going to Evo, but I wonder if he'll even carry on playing the game from now on.
Immortal Reaver
Well-known member
Scorpion is slightly gimmicky but not fully. If you think you only have a 50/50 chance of doing good with him then that means you aren't good at reading your opponent.
the_pathfinder
New member
Wow... I'm bored to TIERS.
Both my mains are on the A+ list, but you know what? F@CK LISTS.:reddy:
I'm getting all TIERRY eyed now.
Both my mains are on the A+ list, but you know what? F@CK LISTS.:reddy:
I'm getting all TIERRY eyed now.
Kzaoo
Active member
I know what you mean. I know this guy who picks EVERY top tier character, literally.
Critical-Limit
New member
Ya if you choose to only use his vortex in every scenario.
it's a tool I dont think you should be putting all your cards on the coin flip especially when your ahead. If your behind. Vortex is a great tool.
Because your trying to catch up and might lose high risk
High reward is in your favor.
Again your only looking at his vortex game. There is more to him than that.
If they do 1,1,1 where would that leave you.
Flagg
New member
I mained Kano for a good two months and felt I got quite good with him. His problems become vastly more apparent in offline. I mean a lot of his strings are negative on block. His choke grab pushes the opponent away. If his strings and specials had similar advantage to Jax's, i'd pick him right up again. Kano suffers from fairly low damage, and it's surprisingly easy to drop his juggles, which you can't afford to do. He doesn't have bad OKI game, but at the end of the day, NRS don't know their frame data which abundantly clear with Kano.
Flagg
New member
See, there is more to Cyrax than retarded resets. The same with Jax and Smoke. If a Kabal decided to not use iagb's once, the character still has tons of options.
What more is there to Scorpion that landing a spear and going for vortex? Hell fire when someone advances on him? Even Kano has a semi decent rush down, and semi decent zoning. You can up-ball a lot of wake up attacks, landing on the other side of the opponent for a free combo.
What's Scorpion got besides trying to land his spear?
Critical-Limit
New member
I agree about cyrax, and I agree about jax and smoke.
Dunno why you brought those up as if they were some sort of counter argument.
Scorpion DOESNT HAVE TO DO 50/50 EVERYTIME he spears.
You can REACT to a jump and anti air, You can REACT to cross over jumps and spear.
having METER gives off the threat that he can spear anytime during pressure if the window is decent enough. And if you're good at that, you'll scare them into blocking at those intervals randomly getting you out of pressure without even using meter.
I agree he has crappy pokes. D3 is crap, I think he's at disadvantage on hit? Don't know off hand, but his D4 isn't too bad when you space it, his D1 is good enough to poke out of pressure.
Threat of a safe Take down at any time during a string can condition you to block low enough that he may go for an overhead.
It's not a simple coin toss. I agree with what Immortal Reaver said. There's all sorts of conditioning available to you to FORCE reactions to land "spears"
There are plenty of safe ways to land spears aka Hit confirm/Anti-air/Counterpunish with EX spear(when 100% sure they are attacking aka like a laggy projectile from Noob Saibot)
You can punish whiff pokes by baiting them safely into a normal into spear.
It's not all 50/50 like you're making it sound like for every match. (It's only somewhat the case when your only goal is Vortex.
Don't generalize a character like that.
I don't go around be like "LOL cyrax and resets, LOL Noob spam projectiles, LOL Sonya and her D4 MS"
I agree he's "More gimmicky" than alot of the cast. But he has options to not do ONLY VORTEX. IF it really was that. But calling him a flat out gimmick imo is a bit much.
anyways, wish I could play you guys with my scorpion
Then why isn't every scrub out there playing scorpion and making it as high as Slips if it's all luck based?
I mean all you gotta do is go in and 50/50 every chance right? and you win half the time lose half the time.
It's not that simple. There are so many scenarios in a scorpion match that doesn't involve vortex. And BECAUSE people keep ONLY PLAYING vortex, his meta game is at a slow pace, because people are stepping it up to his other tools.
I also think it's Matchup based. IMO scorpion has the roughest time with a rush down character like JC, and Sonya. Which is why he resorts to Vortex in those match ups because "Doing a safe thing" like take down still leaves you in defense. And being in DEFENSE against those 2 is a horrible idea.
However against characters like Kung Lao/Rain/Cyrax.
I don't think Scorpion needs the tool of vortex as much as vs JC and Sonya. because Scorpions zoning is lets be honest... terrible and super risky. You can play a LITTLE safe in zoning, but it usually involves doing NOTHING and waiting for their jump. Might have to condition with hellfire a few times yes. I usually walk in and out with scorpion (within their hit range and out of hit range) to bait an approach/jump in. And then punish the whiff.