Do you think Kitana and Mileena would make the cut?

[sub-one]

As far as we know Kitana is dead. She may have some kind of cameo appearance in the netherrealm, but aside from that I wouldn't count on her returning. Milleena was never shown getting the business, nor the rest of Kahn's flunkies, but it can be assumed their sitting their asses in some kind of sorcery enforced, solitary confinement. I think the chances of seeing these two, at least as far as being playable is concerned, can be counted out. It would be nice to see Kitana in all her next-gen glory, but I'm pretty sure this is the MK boon was talking about where he said "I'd like to make an MK with only Scorp, Sub and maybe one or two others returning and the rest will be new. I mean yeah, classic characters have the nostalgia factor working for them, but that tends to get a little old after a while. SF4 is still kicking, but to be perfectly honest I'm getting tired of seeing the same characters game after game. we need some fresh meat and new blood. PLUS for all the nostalgia guys out there we have DLC now so it's possible, but in reality I don't think we're gonna see any other old faces besides the ones already revealed. At least not at launch

 

[FlawlessVictor]

I don't get why both you and iViTal have a problem with a character that I could play as. I never said anywhere that I couldn't play as her. Yeah, she's not in my most used list, but it's not like I don't know what I'm doing with her. If finding a character weak with combos that aren't as good as I thought they should be is a problem to you or anyone else, then man, you must hate it when someone has an opinion that differs from yours. Please, continue hating on an opinion, I'll just continue writing how I feel about a character that's not that hard to play as and wanting her to be a bit different the next time she's in a Mortal Kombat game.

To be fair, iVital provided reasons why Mileena is solid character in MK9. Just because you are allowed to express your opinions doesn't mean nobody can challenge it.

 

[Kitty_55]

To be fair, iVital provided reasons why Mileena is solid character in MK9. Just because you are allowed to express your opinions doesn't mean nobody can challenge it.

There's a difference between challenging an opinion and flat out saying you don't know how to play a character. That's what I'm having an issue with because I never stated anywhee that I couldn't play as her, just found her to be weak. If others see that she isn't, fine, she's not in their eyes. I however did, and for some reason that brought out an issue that doesn't quite make sense to say I am in the wrong when I'm just basing my thoughts of personal play. I never said that she's a horrible character and that she's low tier, I actually don't really care about that kind of stuff. I just said she's weak.

 

[iViTal]

Well, I didn't say that you didn't know how to play the character and I apologize if the way I worded my post gave you that vibe.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Kitty_55]

It sorta did, but it's cool. No worries

 

[iViTal]

It sorta did, but it's cool. No worries

Am I still one of "Those" peoples?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[BBBLP]

I'm still implying that you don't know how to use the character.

#SolidAsARock

 

[Kitty_55]

Nah, I was in a bit of a mood yesterday because I was having an issue with my right leg. Seems I got bit up by bugs pretty good, but they certainly did not look like any bug bites I've ever seen, not really an excuse but... So, I apologize for that comment. Wasn't really a nice thing to blurt out.

I'm still implying that you don't know how to use the character.

#SolidAsARock

K.

 

[Robert Glasel]

All this rampant ridiculous tumblr-privilege talk here about "objectification of Mileena" just made me, well, login through facebook. Just to tell you this:

Mileena IS a 100% object. As an object, can't be objectified more. Or less.

And they're not "women" (or men). They're objects in video games. Fictional characters.

All video game characters in every video game character ever are objects.

And video games won't make you a sexist cis-scum, just like they won't make you murder people.

And yeah, we don't really need (to quote one of you) "trannies" in MK. Btw, the reason Poison is one in the West was the West was uncomfortable with the players being invited to beat women in Final Fight, as this was allegedly deemed sexist or something (as you could only beat men). This was pretty common with the US localizations of JP beat'em ups there days: http://themalesofgames.blogspot.com/2013_03_01_archive.html

Also I'm a fan since 1992 and most everything MK on English Wikipedia was written by me. Hi.

That was probably my only post here, though. (Or maybe I'll stay, who knows.)

 

[chackalacka]

All this rampant ridiculous tumblr-privilege talk here about "objectification of Mileena" just made me, well, login through facebook. Just to tell you this:

Mileena IS a 100% object. As an object, can't be objectified more. Or less.

And they're not a women (or men). They're objects in video games.

All video game characters in every video game character ever are objects.

Also I'm a fan since 1992 and most everything MK on English Wikipedia was written by me. Hi.

That was probably my only post here, though.

Yes but theres a sense of realism involved in terms of their human characteristics and behaviour etc... By your logic, they may aswell be stickmen and no-one would care (which is obviously not true)

 

[Robert Glasel]

Yes but theres a sense of realism involved in terms of their human characteristics and behaviour etc... By your logic, they may aswell be stickmen and no-one would care (which is obviously not true)

No, they're objects. And video game fictional characters will always be just that: objects. And objects can't be objectified, or de-objectified for that matter.

Unless you think that when you do a Fatality on Mileena you're actually ultraviolently murdering a "woman" (and not destroying an object in a video game).

Which also makes me wonder why most tumblr people have no problem with things like http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i6SGjbZtvbM but they have problems with their "unrealistic" high heel boots (because apparently MK is about realism) and how much "sluts" they are (because apparently sex is the same as sexism, also ironically the anti-sex "progressives" of today share the morality standards with religious conservatives).

I like female lead characters, but I rarely get those. But I let people have fun with their games. I don't get all upset because the 60th game in a row has a male lead.

It's kind of a myth. Here's one list of well over 1000 games with female protags that I and some other people compiled recently: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Video_games_featuring_female_protagonists and you really can play no other games but the ones with fem protags and still waste your life on vidya.

It's a very incomplete list and MK isn't even there because Liu Kang is the protag. Also, most games (including most fighting games) just have no fixed protagonists at all.

And when did trannies come into play? lol I'm all for diverse characters but come on.... Lets work on getting a decent representation of women before we dive into the tranny pit.

Female characters in video games don't "represent" women. Like Mileena is not "representing" women (be it sluts or virgins, or anything in between), clones, mutants, otherdimensional monsters, cannibals, or people with really severe dental problems.

 

[Robert Glasel]

I would be pissed if they did a sexuality change, because the first person they'd test it on is Sub-Zero.

Actually Boon toys with an idea of doing it with Scorpion. https://twitter.com/noobde/status/491978868765364224

(Or he's just trolling us again.)

And speaking of Boon, he's hinting the return of Kitana all the time. Like the most recently today: https://twitter.com/noobde/status/493195252736344065

female ninja kombatants need to be fully/properly dressed like in a bathing suit,leather pants & tall knee-high boots & don't show a lot of cleavage.

I lold.

Here you go, DOA:

http://img2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20131017035536/deadoralive/images/6/67/DOA5U_Ayane_CE_Screen.jpg (bathing suit...don't show a lot of cleavage)

http://www.freestepdodge.com/attachments/ayanedoauc6-jpg.3916/ (tall knee-high boots & don't show a lot of cleavage)

http://img3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100915040041/deadoralive/images/9/94/AyaneDOAUC12.jpg (leather pants)

Patriarchy conquered!

But apparently, you
don't know that whatever edit you make has to be
relevant and have a real source, otherwise the edit
is deleted.

That's nice you have so much faith in Wikipedia. But sadly you're wrong. Wikipedia is full of vandalism, idiotic "good faith" content, fringe theories, trolling, and more. Personally (with a lot of insider exposure of how the things are) I have faith only in the articles that I myself wrote.

 

[Kzaoo]

Pretty much what Robert said.

Thing about Tumblristas, though, is that they refuse to change their opinion, even if they're completely irrational.

 

[TimeofTheChimps]

That's nice you have so much faith in Wikipedia. But sadly you're wrong. Wikipedia is full of vandalism, idiotic "good faith" content, fringe theories, trolling, and more. Personally (with a lot of insider exposure of how the things are) I have faith only in the articles that I myself wrote.

SHOW ME an example of trolling. SHOW ME an example of vandalism. Better yet, try to vandalise an article. Bet you that shit gets fixed within the first five minutes of editing. So your basically saying all articles but yours are wrong? That's really arrogant.

 

[Robert Glasel]

Pretty much what Robert said.

Thing about Tumblristas, though, is that they refuse to change their opinion, even if they're completely irrational.

This was also before tumblr, it just wasn't nearly as widespread, because, yeah, there was no tumblr yet. But another major difference is the gamer press reaction to that was "lol" (if any), of at least "wtf, f-off" (for the actually serious stuff like the US congressional hearings) instead of embracing it and actively manufacturing outrage AGAINST video games as a clickbait, like the today's websites do (and no, not just Kotaku or RPS).

Like, take this "representation" buzzword. When I was researching old newspapers for MK stuff, I found not only feminists b-ing about the players being allowed to (gasp) hurt female characters and/or them being sexualized (yes, since the beginning, like in MKII), but also an Asian American activist b-ing about how MK is badly "representing" Asians with stereotypes, including Mileena and Kitana (who aren't even Asians, they're basically aliens, but who cares for such 'details', right?). I wrote about it in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mortal_Kombat_controversies in "Miscellaneous" section (and in some other articles too).

SHOW ME an example of trolling. SHOW ME an example of vandalism. Better yet, try to vandalise an article. Bet you that shit gets fixed within the first five minutes of editing. So your basically saying all articles but yours are wrong? That's really arrogant.

How long do you edit Wikipedia?

Because I only do it since 2003. Yeah, what do I know.

The "shit gets fixed within the first five minutes of editing" only when you do something so blatant that the bots react. The bots that had to be installed precisely due to the massive ammount of daily vandalism.

Oh, and Wikipedia is also full of, literally, propaganda (including disinformation/lies). Often with hostile propagandstists warring with each other over the content, especially regarding the ongoing armed conflicts and such.

And "my" basically saying what?

 

[Kzaoo]

This was also before tumblr, it just wasn't nearly as widespread, because, yeah, there was no tumblr yet. But another major difference is the gamer press reaction to that was "lol" (if any), of at least "wtf, f-off" (the US congressional hearings) instead of embracing it and actively manufacturing outrage AGAINST video games as a clickbait, like the today's websites do (and no, not just Kotaku or RPS).

Like, take this "representation" buzzword. When I was researching old newspapers for MK stuff, I found not only feminists b-ing about the players being allowed to (gasp) hurt female characters and/or them being sexualized (yes, since the beginning, like in MKII), but also an Asian American activist b-ing about how MK is badly "representing" Asians with stereotypes, including Mileena and Kitana (who aren't even Asians, they're basically aliens, but who cares for such 'details', right?). I wrote about it in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mortal_Kombat_controversies in "Miscellaneous" section (and in some other articles too).

Agreed.

Political correctness has always been stupid, especially regarding MK, which due to its controversy has always been a target.

The thing about tumblr is it exposes things that aren't a problem and then a bunch of special snowflakes whine and complain about shit they don't know anything about... Anita Sarkeesian is a prime example of this.

If the MK producers covered women up, no doubt we'd be hearing complaints about how women are forced to hide their sexuality and how their bodies are 'shamed.'

It's a lose/lose situation and the 'patriarchy' is always at fault, lol.

Honestly, people have always looked for excuses to complain. Tumblr is the perfect outlet for that since it's just one big circlejerk... but what do know? I'm just a cishet scum man.

I don't think they understand such simple concepts as fantasy.

Creative freedom, what is that?

 

[Ricochetmatt]

Why are we bringing this debate back from the dead?

All I can say is there is a lot of ignorance in your post, Robert. Now let this sh** die.

 

[FlawlessVictor]

There's a difference between challenging an opinion and flat out saying you don't know how to play a character. That's what I'm having an issue with because I never stated anywhee that I couldn't play as her, just found her to be weak. If others see that she isn't, fine, she's not in their eyes. I however did, and for some reason that brought out an issue that doesn't quite make sense to say I am in the wrong when I'm just basing my thoughts of personal play.

If someone is wrong, they need to be told they are wrong. Personal experience alone doesn't say a whole lot. Competition could be weak and there are a lot of people who are not as good as they think they are.

I never said that she's a horrible character and that she's low tier, I actually don't really care about that kind of stuff. I just said she's weak.

Weak and low tier pretty much imply the same thing. You are saying that she has disadvantages that require the player to work harder against the rest of the cast when others have pointed out she isn't bad in the grand scheme of things.

 

[Robert Glasel]

Agreed.

Political correctness has always been stupid, especially regarding MK, which due to its controversy has always been a target.

I find it especially funny and really ironic how people today like to contrast the reboot game with MKII where there was no sexism and racism and other patriarchy after Boon & Co became NRS and all of sudden turned such cis scum.

So I'll just quote myself from Mileena's article:

In the 1996 moral panic themed book Interacting With Video, which condemned violence of video games as supposedly affecting social behaviour and causing real-life violence, Patricia Marks Greenfield and Rodney R. ing used the "two Asian twin sisters, Mileena and Kitana," as an example of a "highly eroticized dragon lady" trope, with Mileena's "Man-Eater" Fatality described as "a high powered kiss that evokes vagina dentata." The authors wrote that despite the inclusion of "characters of color" such as the two and Jax, "we cannot assume that this greater diversity represents a more progressive identity politics, for one could argue that it merely increases the racist and sexist potential of individual fights."[180]

All I can say is there is a lot of ignorance in your post, Robert.

Can you elaborate please?

 

[Ricochetmatt]

Can you elaborate please?

Fiction reflects reality. Always had, always will. When MK9 came out there were lots of complaints pertaining to the way the women were portrayed. People care because it does effect them. I know a few women who wont even touch MK anymore due to MK9's treatment of the female characters. It was out of control. When a character who is part of a special forces unit is reduced to some sort of cheap looking military themed stripper, there's a serious problem. The series was never as bad as it was during MK9 when it comes to the portrayal of women. And now with video game developers actively trying to change the representation of women in gaming, Mortal Kombat couldn't have released that sh** at a worse time.

People are getting sick of that garbage. And if MK wants to be taken seriously, they will forget all about whatever it was that made them stick a strong non-sexualized character in heels and an open vest with no undershirt or bra beneath it.

Go back to editing WIKIPEDIA pages and let this old conversation rest in peace.