Let's discuss possible SubZero storylines

[Taj Gill]

LOL, this is hilarious. I love the story of Mortal Kombat, but this is absolute nonsense on NRS's part, we should not be THIS confused and asking so many goddamn questions and coming up with potential answers where they can answer JUST AS EASILY.

We're basically at X-Men film series level of wanting answers.

 

[Commander]

Maybe the Lin Kuei accepted payment for Shang Tsung's assassination under the table. Ever considered THAT theory?

Sure, that's a possible theory too, but that was never explained or touched upon in MK9.


Also, in favor of Bi-Han being this new Sub-Zero in MK X:

Why the hell would NRS have Raiden say in MK9,

"He once defended Earthrealm from the Netherrealm armies of Shinnok and Quan Chi,"

have Quan Chi and Shinnok show up at the end of the MK9 story, and NOT have the possibility of the Elder Gods returning Bi-Han as Sub-Zero via saving him from the Soulnado, to stop Quan Chi and Shinnok once again in MK X?
Does that just seem a little bit too damn coincidental for anyone else???

 

[TheDeaconBosco]

LOL, this is hilarious. I love the story of Mortal Kombat, but this is absolute nonsense on NRS's part, we should not be THIS confused and asking so many goddamn questions and coming up with potential answers where they can answer JUST AS EASILY.

Yeah, I agree... I'm not against Araknyd's theory, but it's just that, a theory.
He can't prove that this timeline is different to the other even before that Raiden received his first vision, more than I can prove him otherwise. I think we should move on to something else, I really don't think NRS will give us a clear answer to that conondrum.
And that's why I don't like when writers uses time travels, it just raises too many questions.

 

[Commander]

Yeah, I agree... I'm not against Araknyd's theory, but it's just that, a theory.
He can't prove that this timeline is different to the other even before that Raiden received his first vision, more than I can prove him otherwise. I think we should move on to something else, I really don't think NRS will give us a clear answer to that conondrum.
And that's why I don't like when writers uses time travels, it just raises too many questions.

Agreed that these are all just theories, which is my point and why we also can't auto-assume that MKM:SZ happened in this timeline too.

For all we know, maybe MKM:SZ didn't happen and Sub-Zero found another way to stop Quan Chi and Shinnok in the past.

 

[Reman]

I'm beginning to think that the Lin Kuei were planning to play both sides, killing Tsung once he had payed them.

It wouldn't be above the Lin Kuei, so it is certainly plausible.

 

[Subz 711]

Sure, that's a possible theory too, but that was never explained or touched upon in MK9.


Also, in favor of Bi-Han being this new Sub-Zero in MK X:

Why the hell would NRS have Raiden say in MK9, have Quan Chi and Shinnok show up at the end of the MK9 story, and NOT have the possibility of the Elder Gods returning Bi-Han as Sub-Zero via saving him from the Soulnado, to stop Quan Chi and Shinnok once again in MK X?
Does that just seem a little bit too damn coincidental for anyone else???

I've already argued he can do the exact same shit as Noob Saibot though. His ending in MK9 even hints it.

Also, if they wanted that to.happen then NRS should have just had Scorpion spare his ass in MK9. Cyber Sub still could have happened and everything. They still killed him though, and still made him Noob Saibot. Hell, leaving him alive in MK9 THAT would have been a change.

 

[Commander]

I've already argued he can do the exact same shit as Noob Saibot though. His ending in MK9 even hints it.

Arcade endings aren't always canon, though, ever since Konquest and Story Mode came into play.
It may happen, or it may not.
I'm just throwing out a theory, because until MK X reveals new info, that's all these conversations really are; theories.

Also, if they wanted that to.happen then NRS should have just had Scorpion spare his ass in MK9. Cyber Sub still could have happened and everything. They still killed him though, and still made him Noob Saibot. Hell, leaving him alive in MK9 THAT would have been a change.

Then why even bother mentioning in MK9 that Bi-Han is the one who stopped Quan Chi and Shinnok in the past, at all, and have Shinnok and Quan Chi show up in the end, only for them NOT to use him in MK X?
MK X Sub-Zero being Bi-Han makes sense, IMO, when those pieces are put together, that somehow Bi-Han was brought back to once again protect Earthrealm against the armies of Shinnok and Quan Chi in MK X.

 

[TheDeaconBosco]

At this point I'm open to all theories concerning this Sub Zero, except the one Ed Boon alluded to...
The Lin Kuei now supposedly have "a sea of Sub Zeroes"?! Where the Netherrealm does that come from?
I mean, talk about assassination of character, a glorious mantle shared between two brothers now gets associated to a "sea "of glorified Konquest mode grunts? Give me a break.
I really hope he was talking out of his ass, talking about his secret fantasy where Scorpion kills Sub Zeroes by the dozen singlehandedly or something. :-?

Then why even bother mentioning in MK9 that Bi-Han is the one who stopped Quan Chi and Shinnok in the past, at all, and have Shinnok and Quan Chi show up in the end, only for them NOT to use him in MK X?
MK X Sub-Zero being Bi-Han makes sense, IMO, when those pieces are put together, that somehow Bi-Han was brought back to once again protect Earthrealm against the armies of Shinnok and Quan Chi in MK X.

You're looking far to much into it, it might just be a reference to Mythologies. Same when they referenced Quan Chi and Shang Tsung's Deadly Alliance (I'm pretty sure that's just an inside joke though).

 

[Taj Gill]

At this point I'm open to all theories concerning this Sub Zero, except the one Ed Boon alluded to...
The Lin Kuei now supposedly have "a sea of Sub Zeroes"?! Where the Netherrealm does that come from?
I mean, talk about assassination of character, a glorious mantle shared between two brothers now gets associated to a "sea "of glorified Konquest mode grunts? Give me a break.
I really hope he was talking out of his ass, talking about his secret fantasy where Scorpion kills Sub Zeroes by the dozen singlehandedly or something. :-?

I totally agree, this is why I made my point of Kuai and Han being abducted by the Lin Kuei as opposed to the other members. It even states in Sub-Zero's bio that I posted a few pages back, that "unlike other members of his clan, they were abducted as children and raised in the assassination arts their entire lives".

Why would they make the "unlike other members" statement if there are other people abducted for their "gifts" that Kuai and Han have?

This is why I believe the NEW Sub-Zero theory is false unless NRS do a retcon, or it is someone directly RELATED to the Subby Bros.

 

[Subz 711]

Arcade endings aren't always canon, though, ever since Konquest and Story Mode came into play.
It may happen, or it may not.
I'm just throwing out a theory, because until MK X reveals new info, that's all these conversations really are; theories.




Then why even bother mentioning in MK9 that Bi-Han is the one who stopped Quan Chi and Shinnok in the past, at all, and have Shinnok and Quan Chi show up in the end, only for them NOT to use him in MK X?
MK X Sub-Zero being Bi-Han makes sense, IMO, when those pieces are put together, that somehow Bi-Han was brought back to once again protect Earthrealm against the armies of Shinnok and Quan Chi in MK X.

I don't think it matters whether or not he is Noob Saibot or Sub-Zero though. Also even though we know what Raiden was talking about in MK9 stating that Bi-Han defended Earth in the past, the general audience won't piece that together. Also, you're contradicting yourself again Araknyd. You're saying in this timeline Bi-Han may not have done the things he accomplished in Mythologies. Then you turn right back around and say Raiden mentioning this in MK9 gives him sooo much reason to return as Sub-Zero. You're using points when it benefits your argument saying that mythologies probably didn't happen, but when it leads to Bi-Han coming back it did happen. Which is it?

Plus what exactly do you do with Kuai at all? I mean we have established that cyber subz was universally disliked. Plus he is STILL Sub-Zero as of MK9. The announcer even refers to him as Sub-Zero not Cyber Sub-Zero. Then there's the whole Grandmaster style and you cannot just shrug that off as nothing. Bi-han would be stealing Kuai's story as well as Scorpion's. It's just bad. He's not even his own character anymore. Meanwhile if he stays as Noob Saibot he can overtake the netherrealm. Something we never saw in the old timeline.

Also in regards to these intros. It's been established that Scorpion and Sub-Zero may not even be enemies come MK9. However, fans have been waiting a while for some of these interactions or character specific intros. So, even if they aren't enemies, it makes sense from a developer's standpoint to add intros from when they WERE enemies. Because this really is the first time we have received anything like this.

 

[MK_Reaper]

At this point I'm open to all theories concerning this Sub Zero, except the one Ed Boon alluded to...
The Lin Kuei now supposedly have "a sea of Sub Zeroes"?! Where the Netherrealm does that come from?
I mean, talk about assassination of character, a glorious mantle shared between two brothers now gets associated to a "sea "of glorified Konquest mode grunts? Give me a break.
I really hope he was talking out of his ass, talking about his secret fantasy where Scorpion kills Sub Zeroes by the dozen singlehandedly or something. :-?



You're looking far to much into it, it might just be a reference to Mythologies. Same when they referenced Quan Chi and Shang Tsung's Deadly Alliance (I'm pretty sure that's just an inside joke though).

Since the original Mortal kombat.

After reading through all the theories Bi Han makes more sense then anyone else and you just can't right off Mk mythologies not counting, it does. Nothing has changed in the new timeline till Raiden had his vision. So Mk mythologies still happened as it was even mentioned in mk9. Not saying Bi Han coming back is fact but it makes alot more sense then kuai liang coming back

 

[Commander]

You're looking far to much into it, it might just be a reference to Mythologies. Same when they referenced Quan Chi and Shang Tsung's Deadly Alliance (I'm pretty sure that's just an inside joke though).

Agreed.
That being said, the reference doesn't mean Mythologies happened in this new alternate timeline either.
Shang Tsung and Quan Chi's Deadly Alliance was mentioned in the Coliseum (Kung Lao chapter), but the Deadly Alliance may not happen at all, now that Shang Tsung died in MK9.

 

[TheDeaconBosco]

I totally agree, this is why I made my point of Kuai and Han being abducted by the Lin Kuei as opposed to the other members. It even states in Sub-Zero's bio that I posted a few pages back, that "unlike other members of his clan, they were abducted as children and raised in the assassination arts their entire lives".

Why would they make the "unlike other members" statement if there are other people abducted for their "gifts" that Kuai and Han have?

This is why I believe the NEW Sub-Zero theory is false unless NRS do a retcon, or it is someone directly RELATED to the Subby Bros.

I just realized, aren't the Lin Kuei all Cyber Ninjas anyway.
I mean, with both Sub Zero brothers AND Smoke out of commission, there's nobody left after MK9's ending with a motive to stop the cyber initiative and restore the clan to it's former self.
So yeah, this Sub Zero is at least pretty much guarenteed to be it's own man, that's a relief.

 

[MK_Reaper]

I do have to say that NRS needs a little more solid work with 'Sub-Zeros' story. He seems to be the most debated character with his appearance and story. There was just as much debate in mk9, mkda, and mkd with his appearance and story

 

[Taj Gill]

I just realized, aren't the Lin Kuei all Cyber Ninjas anyway.
I mean, with both Sub Zero brothers AND Smoke out of commission, there's nobody left after MK9's ending with a motive to stop the cyber initiative and restore the clan to it's former self.
So yeah, this Sub Zero is at least pretty much guarenteed to be it's own man, that's a relief.

Right and Grandmaster variation, along with the Lin Kuei insignia on his outfit, could potentially lead to this Sub-Zero to eventually being the Grandmaster in Story Mode. Meaning he overcomes his former Brethren.

I do have to say that NRS needs a little more solid work with 'Sub-Zeros' story. He seems to be the most debated character with his appearance and story. There was just as much debate in mk9, mkda, and mkd with his appearance and story

I'd thank your post if I could Reaper, but this is exactly my stance on this. They just make it more and more confusing with all the changes they unnecessarily make.

 

[Commander]

I don't think it matters whether or not he is Noob Saibot or Sub-Zero though. Also even though we know what Raiden was talking about in MK9 stating that Bi-Han defended Earth in the past, the general audience won't piece that together. Also, you're contradicting yourself again Araknyd. You're saying in this timeline Bi-Han may not have done the things he accomplished in Mythologies. Then you turn right back around and say Raiden mentioning this in MK9 gives him sooo much reason to return as Sub-Zero. You're using points when it benefits your argument saying that mythologies probably didn't happen, but when it leads to Bi-Han coming back it did happen. Which is it?

Plus what exactly do you do with Kuai at all? I mean we have established that cyber subz was universally disliked. Plus he is STILL Sub-Zero as of MK9. The announcer even refers to him as Sub-Zero not Cyber Sub-Zero. Then there's the whole Grandmaster style and you cannot just shrug that off as nothing. Bi-han would be stealing Kuai's story as well as Scorpion's. It's just bad. He's not even his own character anymore. Meanwhile if he stays as Noob Saibot he can overtake the netherrealm. Something we never saw in the old timeline.

Also in regards to these intros. It's been established that Scorpion and Sub-Zero may not even be enemies come MK9. However, fans have been waiting a while for some of these interactions or character specific intros. So, even if they aren't enemies, it makes sense from a developer's standpoint to add intros from when they WERE enemies. Because this really is the first time we have received anything like this.

No.
I'm not contradicting anything.
You are misunderstanding.
Raiden mentioning Bi-Han stopping Shinnok and Quan Chi before doesn't automatically mean that Mythologies happened in the MK9 timeline, given that it may be an alternate version of events.
The Deadly Alliance was also mentioned in MK9, in the Coliseum before Kung Lao was killed, but the Deadly Alliance part of MK may not happen at all in MK X, now that Shang Tsung is dead.
Maybe Sub-Zero found a way to beat the armies of Shinnok and Quan Chi that wasn't Mythologies related, which is my point.

I'm not shrugging of Grandmaster at all.
If I recall correctly Bi-Han and Kuai-Liang were BOTH human Sub-Zero on the select screen via alternate costumes, were they not?
I'm just giving credence as to why 1 of the Sub-Zero variations could be Bi-Han.
Saibot can still take over the Netherrealm if Bi-Han is separated via the Elder Gods / Soulnado theory.
This way we have Saibot and 1 variation that is Bi-Han.
It would actually explain why in 1 variation Bi-Han would say "Shirai Ryu dog" and in another variation Kuai-Liang would say "I tire of maintaining out innocence."

Sure, I agree with you that the intros may not be related, but you can't ignore that "Shirai Ryu dog" sounds like something that Bi-Han would say.
"I tire of maintaining our innocence" could be either brother, but Grandmaster points to Kuai.
Don't know what to tell ya, man. :|

 

[MK_Reaper]

Mythologies took place before Raiden had his visions. So how does that get written off? Even if it wasn't mentioned in mk9 its still cannon

Edit: also the original timeline is still cannon as well. For Mk 9 and mkx to happen those previous games had to happen. But yes it is on a new timeline so things will be different like maybe there will be no deadly alliance just an example but on the alternate timeline that still had to happen. Excluding mythologies that happened regardless

 

[Commander]

Mythologies took place before Raiden had his visions. So how does that get written off? Even if it wasn't mentioned in mk9 its still cannon

Edit: also the original timeline is still cannon as well. For Mk 9 and mkx to happen those previous games had to happen. But yes it is on a new timeline so things will be different like maybe there will be no deadly alliance just an example but on the alternate timeline that still had to happen

How do you know that it happens for sure in the MK9 timeline, and NRS didn't write it off?
NRS had no problem writing off the Deadly Alliance in MK9, by killing Shang Tsung.

We don't know if Mythologies still happened, though.
How do you know that Boon didn't wipe out Mythilogies and only kept the "He once defended Earthrealm from the Netherrealm armies of Shinnok and Quan Chi," part of it.
Tobias also worked on Mythologies, so it's possible that Boon doesn't care for it as he doesn't care for Sub-Zero getting repeatedly killed, and why Noob Saibot only had "NOOB" in the MK9 life bar.

 

[MK_Reaper]

How do you know that it happens for sure in the MK9 timeline, and NRS didn't write it off?
NRS had no problem writing off the Deadly Alliance in MK9, by killing Shang Tsung.

We don't know if Mythologies still happened, though.
How do you know that Boon didn't wipe out Mythilogies and only kept the "He once defended Earthrealm from the Netherrealm armies of Shinnok and Quan Chi," part of it.
Tobias also worked on Mythologies, so it's possible that Boon doesn't care for it as he doesn't care for Sub-Zero getting repeatedly killed, and why Noob Saibot only had "NOOB" in the MK9 life bar.

There's no evidence that points that he dead and yes they killed Shang tsung but mkda took place after Mk 1 so we already know that once Raiden got his visions all future events are changed. However mythologies already took place before Raiden received his future visions

 

[Commander]

There's no evidence that points that he dead and yes they killed Shang tsung but mkda took place after Mk 1 so we already know that once Raiden got his visions all future events are changed. However mythologies already took place before Raiden received his future visions

Given that NRS hit the reset button in MK9, with a new timeline, how do we know that Mythologies still happened, though?

"He once defended Earthrealm from the Netherrealm armies of Shinnok and Quan Chi" =/= automatically mean Mythologies.

How do you know that Quan Chi and Shinnok didn't try to invade Earthrealm once but Sub-Zero stopped them, and now that both Sub-Zero's are dead they don't think that anyone can stop them?