Hey... uh.. you all. What's your thoughts on THIS one?

[Critical-Limit]

Yes, and my point is that the way a character plays is only a small part of what that character is to me. There's also the way they look, the way they sound, their personality, their role in the MK mythos and what they can bring to the story. On pretty much all of these, Frost is going to be a bust no matter what. The comic has already confirmed that she is a tool in the new continuity as much as she was in the old one. I don't want any more tools on the roster, and I certainly don't want the comic to be retconned within a month of it coming out.

edit: also it's facetious.

"Look" besides being a blue ninja this is the only thing similar besides Ice.

"Sound" one's male one's female. They're going to sound completely different.

"Personality" They have completely different goals. And with the new continuity who knows what she'll become.

"Role" her original role wasn't so bad. She didn't have anything for the MAIN plot. But not every character has to or will. There are multiple sub-plots. And the whole scorpion/subzero thing is one of them. It's a side story to the main story.

I don't know how you can immediately assume she's a tool in the new comic, when you've had like 3 pages of her, and she barely spoke. We'll have to WAIT and see how she really is going to be. Might be a different person after being saved by someone who's suppose to kill them.

 

[p.W]

"Look" besides being a blue ninja this is the only thing similar besides Ice.

That's already a lot as far as I'm concerned. Another ninja = unoriginal. Another ice user = unoriginal. With all the parents and all the MK1-2 characters returning, the next new (unhinted at) character should feel as much a breath of fresh air as Kotal Kahn or D'Vorah did.

Frost will never qualify for that, even if she's revamped as a non-ninja who has nothing to do with Sub-Zero.

"Personality" They have completely different goals. And with the new continuity who knows what she'll become.

I don't know how you can immediately assume she's a tool in the new comic, when you've had like 3 pages of her, and she barely spoke.

Having a different personality/goals from Sub-Zero isn't enough to warrant a spot on the roster, though. Hsu Hao also had a different goal from Sub-Zero, that doesn't mean I want him on the roster, and I don't want Frost either.

In the original timeline, Frost was a power-hungry idiot whose biggest claim to fame was accidentally freezing herself almost to death. In the new timeline, she's an arrogant idiot who fights regular humans in an MMA ring and loses to a child with almost no superpowers. Cassie is 16 years old in the comic. And she beats Frost. In an MMA fight.

I'm not sure you understand how much NRS would have to work to salvage her in my eyes after that.

Why the hell is she picking on regular humans in a random MMA ring in Los Angeles to begin with? It would be bad enough if we randomly saw Sub-Zero fighting in an MMA ring... but at least he has 20 years of us already thinking that he's a bad ass to override something that dumb. But Frost? All this did was add to my image of her as a complete non-entity. At least Hsu Hao actually managed to beat up Kenshi. (Still don't want him in, though.)

"Role" her original role wasn't so bad. She didn't have anything for the MAIN plot. But not every character has to or will. There are multiple sub-plots. And the whole scorpion/subzero thing is one of them. It's a side story to the main story.

So let her appear in a cameo like Sindel does, and play her insignificant role in a sub-sub-sub plot without taking up a roster space. MKX doesn't have 100 roster slots, the roster is a zero-sum game: if Frost gets in, it means someone else didn't. Why would I ever want her playable, when Reiko, Baraka, Sektor, Cyrax, Noob Saibot, Smoke, and Shang Tsung are all still MIA? I'd take any one of them over her in a heartbeat. I'd even take Kabal, even though I loathe his MK9 design and moves, because MKX's design team would probably make him look like a beast.

 

[Critical-Limit]

That's already a lot as far as I'm concerned. Another ninja = unoriginal. Another ice user = unoriginal. With all the parents and all the MK1-2 characters returning, the next new (unhinted at) character should feel as much a breath of fresh air as Kotal Kahn or D'Vorah did. Frost will never qualify for that.



Having a different personality/goals from Sub-Zero isn't enough to warrant a spot on the roster, though. Hsu Hao also had a different goal from Sub-Zero, that doesn't mean I want him on the roster, and I don't want Frost either.

In the original timeline, Frost was a power-hungry idiot whose biggest claim to fame was accidentally freezing herself almost to death. In the new timeline, she's an arrogant idiot who fights regular humans in an MMA ring and loses to a child with almost no superpowers. Cassie is 16 years old in the comic. And she beats Frost. In an MMA fight.

I'm not sure you understand how much NRS would have to work to salvage her in my eyes after that.

Why the hell is she picking on regular humans in a random MMA ring in Los Angeles to begin with? It would be bad enough if we randomly saw Sub-Zero fighting in an MMA ring... but at least he has 20 years of us already thinking that he's a bad ass to override something that dumb. But Frost? All this did was add to my image of her as a complete non-entity. At least Hsu Hao actually managed to beat up Kenshi. (Still don't want him in, though.)



So let her appear in a cameo like Sindel does, and play her insignificant role in a sub-sub-sub plot without taking up a roster space. MKX doesn't have 100 roster slots, the roster is a zero-sum game: if Frost gets in, it means someone else didn't. Why would I ever want her playable, when Reiko, Baraka, Sektor, Noob Saibot, Smoke, and Shang Tsung are all still MIA? I'd take any one of them over her in a heartbeat. I'd even take Kabal, even though I loathe his MK9 design and moves, because MKX's design team would probably make him look like a beast.

I was only listing down the criteria that you stated "matters to you"

If blue ninja with ice is enough to deter you, I guess we can just leave it at that lol.


you're only going to play a few characters if you're looking to be good at fighting games. And you're auto-assuming w/e they come up with for those MIA characters will automatically be better.

 

[p.W]

you're only going to play a few characters if you're looking to be good at fighting games. And you're auto-assuming w/e they come up with for those MIA characters will automatically be better.

I'm not a competitive player though. It doesn't matter how OP/strong Reptile is, I'll never play as him because he doesn't appeal to me. So all Reptile will ever be to me in MKX is a character in the MK universe who helps flesh it out and make the world more interesting. The same would be true of Frost and Shang Tsung.

So let's say we give Frost a complete overhaul (that stays true to the fact that she lost to a 16 year old in an MMA fight... I'm not letting her live that shit down) and a bit of MKX's story, does she have the same potential as - for example - Shang Tsung if he got the same treatment? Of course not.

Now, if we're just talking about DLC, which means characters who have zero presence in the story by default... then there are characters I'd rather see before her, simple as that. Take Tremor, who can literally be reinvented from scratch to be as much of a badass as NRS would want, with a completely unique moveset and a completely unique appearance. Why would I ever want Frost in ahead of him? Or take Reiko, who deserves to become better known to new MK fans so that his role can get bigger and bigger as the franchise continues to grow.

There's a long list of MK characters I'd like to see reinvented as DLC, but it's about priorities, you know? I don't go around talking about Havik and Hotaru just because I like them, because it makes absolutely zero sense to include them when other, far more deserving characters could still not make the cut. And you better believe Frost is lower on my list than Havik and Hotaru.

 

[Misucra]

Yes, and my point is that the way a character plays is only a small part of what that character is to me. There's also the way they look, the way they sound, their personality, their role in the MK mythos and what they can bring to the story. On pretty much all of these, Frost is going to be a bust no matter what. The comic has already confirmed that she is a tool in the new continuity as much as she was in the old one. I don't want any more tools on the roster, and I certainly don't want the comic to be retconned within a month of it coming out.

edit: also it's facetious.

No one needs to retcon comic. Frost was shown when Cassie was how old? 15-16. And she was carried away by special forces and oh yes they gonna completely ignore breathing human being with temperature of the corpse. So either she joins special forces or gets sent to Lin Kuei. Even so her appearance in comic was poorly done in my opinion.

 

[Misucra]

At least Hsu Hao actually managed to beat up Kenshi.

Yeah tired, from all night running with injured leg (broken bone not to mention). What an achievement. Indeed. No wonder Hsu Hao got killed with one punch.

Frost was done as a quick cameo anyway. And again no idea how old Frost was there. Maybe also just an 18 or so year old brat.

Anyway your opinion on this matter is set. But unfortunately for you other people want her.

 

[p.W]

No one needs to retcon comic. Frost was shown when Cassie was how old? 15-16. And she was carried away by special forces and oh yes they gonna completely ignore breathing human being with temperature of the corpse. So either she joins special forces or gets sent to Lin Kuei. Even so her appearance in comic was poorly done in my opinion.

More or less poorly done than that time she stole a mid-tier amulet from the only character in the lore who gave a shit about her, and couldn't handle its power so she froze almost to death?

Anyway your opinion on this matter is set. But unfortunately for you other people want her.

Her exclusion from the game will give me the strength I will need to carry on in these difficult times.

In all seriousness, if you've read my posts then it should be clear that I don't hate her. I just don't think she should be playable. So I see nothing unfortunate about someone out there thinking she's the shit.

 

[GloriousDK]

I mean... I'm not wild about Frost. And maybe my standards aren't too high and I can only barely churn out 10 minute plays that are pretty much one big long trope joke. But you know, I'm trying to smell what the NRS is cooking. I never gave one wet donkey shit about Kano and I admit that even when I first saw him I thought NRS lost their natural game designer minds. But you know... he grew on me. Cassie Cage grew on me. Kotal grew on me. Every character so far has been really interesting and unique and it's not like I expect this game to be cut from the same cloth as HBO original shows or Game of Thrones. But so far, NRS seems to be doing something right because Mortal Kombat and its characters are starting to get just as interesting as the Street Fighter lore and that's pretty bloody exciting. I'll even admit that I really loved seeing Frost in a woman's MMA outfit. It was like seeing for the first time, some character who had extraordinary ability yet didn't fully understand it. What we haven't gotten with Frost is more exploration as to who she is. The comics are unfortunately far too short and sweet. They read like quick vignettes more than actual comic books. But what we don't get to really see is Frost trying to come to terms with her powers. Trying to make sense of why it's the case and then to be discovered by the Lin Kuei clan and given a place to finally belong? Now we've got something to go with here. Now we could see this young woman experience being a part of something where she wasn't just some freakish spectacle. We get to see her be driven by a jubilant and wild ambition for greater understanding that leads to a lust for more power. Admittedly, it'd be very similar to say... Anikin Skywalker. I actually expect to see a lot of that with Scorpion's pupil. Perhaps Frost, cutting her teeth in underground deathmatches makes her a very petulant apprentice to Sub Zero. She can be made interesting.

 

[p.W]

But so far, NRS seems to be doing something right because Mortal Kombat and its characters are starting to get just as interesting as the Street Fighter lore and that's pretty bloody exciting.

W-wha?

Wha-huh?

You're comparing the (admittedly meager) depth of Mortal Kombat characters, who have a decent film, a decent webseries (2 seasons), a decent comic book, and 4 games' worth of actual plot behind them... to Jean Claude Van Damme and bio cards in 2015?

 

[GloriousDK]

Street Fighter has had several animes from Japan. Most of them fairly decent. LOVE Street Fighter Alpha. If you haven't seen it.... mmm.

 

[Daigoro]

W-wha?

Wha-huh?

You're comparing the (admittedly meager) depth of Mortal Kombat characters, who have a decent film, a decent webseries (2 seasons), a decent comic book, and 4 games' worth of actual plot behind them... to Jean Claude Van Damme and bio cards in 2015?

There are lots of SF comics, Animes and some Animated Movies too. Most of the
SF chars may not have a very deep or good story, but there are some exceptions.
Gouki's Story and his intentions are very well done, imo.

@Topic: It looks very, very fake.

 

[Misucra]

More or less poorly done than that time she stole a mid-tier amulet from the only character in the lore who gave a shit about her, and couldn't handle its power so she froze almost to death?

Why do you think when we (even Frost fans) are asking for a full revamp? I mean a lot of people here (I think) would agree that original Frost timeline SUCKED. Her story was basically like that: Help sub, betray sub, freeze herself, wake up, attack sub, get frozen again, wake up AGAIN, die. Here is the story of Frost.

This timeline's writer makes even LESS sense. Frost kicks Cassie's ass (let's not play age card here, cause for all we know Frost herself was 16-18 at that time (I am assuming that as Frost doesn't look any older than Cassie)) then get's a surprise headbutt (who the hell get's their face THAT close towards opponent in DEATHMATCH, but ok let's say ARROGANCE) and allows to be knocked out by grappling move, which is a REALLY bad idea, ESPECIALLY when facing a goddamn Cryomancer. But for the sake of plot Frost forgot her ice powers and just let Cassie do her thing. If that was a friendly match I wouldn't say anything. But then writer states that Frost fought 21 of Life and Death battles (would be natural to assume that she fought even more before coming to this ring) and still was shown to make mistakes like some newbie... I can't blame Frost. I blame idiotic writing. If Frost has to lose for the plot at least make it believable. Or don't add a huge number of fights and just say Frost is as new as Cassie here. Clearly writer hasn't seen a real MMA match. Normal guys last longer in there and we are talking about Mortal Kombat universe here. A place where getting blades in your eyeballs is shrugged off as a simple injury.

So basically (again I assume) a lot of people are not asking for the Old or Similar Frost to come back. Just like me a lot of people see POTENTIAL in Frost. But it has to be executed properly. And I mean like really PROPERLY. And if NRS decides to remake Frost, then I really hope they won't put the same guy who did the comic story (Bless his work as he really made super interesting MK MAIN story, but he really messed up that part with Frost. And I am not saying this as Frost fan, but as a fellow comic book artist.)

 

[Temptress]

Why do you think when we (even Frost fans) are asking for a full revamp? I mean a lot of people here (I think) would agree that original Frost timeline SUCKED. Her story was basically like that: Help sub, betray sub, freeze herself, wake up, attack sub, get frozen again, wake up AGAIN, die. Here is the story of Frost.

This timeline's writer makes even LESS sense. Frost kicks Cassie's ass (let's not play age card here, cause for all we know Frost herself was 16-18 at that time (I am assuming that as Frost doesn't look any older than Cassie)) then get's a surprise headbutt (who the hell get's their face THAT close towards opponent in DEATHMATCH, but ok let's say ARROGANCE) and allows to be knocked out by grappling move, which is a REALLY bad idea, ESPECIALLY when facing a goddamn Cryomancer. But for the sake of plot Frost forgot her ice powers and just let Cassie do her thing. If that was a friendly match I wouldn't say anything. But then writer states that Frost fought 21 of Life and Death battles (would be natural to assume that she fought even more before coming to this ring) and still was shown to make mistakes like some newbie... I can't blame Frost. I blame idiotic writing. If Frost has to lose for the plot at least make it believable. Or don't add a huge number of fights and just say Frost is as new as Cassie here. Clearly writer hasn't seen a real MMO. Normal guys last longer in there and we are talking about Mortal Kombat universe here. A place where getting blades in your eyeballs is shrugged off as a simple injury.

So basically (again I assume) a lot of people are not asking for the Old or Similar Frost to come back. Just like me a lot of people see POTENTIAL in Frost. But it has to be executed properly. And I mean like really PROPERLY. And if NRS decides to remake Frost, then I really hope they won't put the same guy who did the comic story (Bless his work as he really made super interesting MK MAIN story, but he really messed up that part with Frost. And I am not saying this as Frost fan, but as a fellow comic book artist.)

Just a tad biased.

 

[Misucra]

Just a tad biased.

Hmmm... Any kind of explanation?

 

[Temptress]

Hmmm... Any kind of explanation?

Writing a giant paragraph complaining about Frost (who happens to be your favourite character) losing and then refusing to accept the fact that Frost lost because she was inferior to Cassie is a pretty good example of being biased. You even went as far as to try and blame the writers, which is kinda sad. You're completely underestimating Cassie.

 

[Misucra]

Writing a giant paragraph complaining about Frost (who happens to be your favourite character) losing and then refusing to accept the fact that Frost lost because she was inferior to Cassie is a pretty good example of being biased. You even went as far as to try and blame the writers, which is kinda sad. You're completely underestimating Cassie.

Hmmm... wait one second. Let me check what I wrote. Hmm. Did I complain that Frost lost? No. I said I disliked on HOW she lost. Secondly.

"Frost lost because she was inferior to Cassie"

"INFERIOR"

Spoiler:

Yes, you're right, Cassie was mopping the floor with Frost. Damn that explains why Frost lost. She had no chance against Cassie. I truly underestimated Cassie's power.

And here is the part which I call bullsh%t
THIS

She is completely at Frost mercy. In any other deathmatch this would be finished quickly, but Frost somehow especially for her decided to do monologue. But it is ok. She will say her monologue and freeze Cassie. RIGHT?

Where is the freezing ball? What she is doing with her hand there? She wants to pet her or something? Who the hell does that in a Deathmatch??? Every other character who died didn't have a chance even to talk. Hsu Hao or Kotal's father for example. Once the fight started, it went non stop until character was killed in fast and brutal way. And Frost had a killshot. A freaking KILLSHOT. But somehow magically decided. Nah. Let's better stop charging freezing ball and put our face right in front of Cassie. FOR SCIENCE.

And who is responsible for that? Writer. Who else wrote this? No one, but the writer. So yeah I can blame him for a Cheap, making no sense, half assed written fight. Again so you would finally NOTICE what I am saying. I am NOT mad at the fact that Frost LOST. Losing actually helps in building the character. I am mad at the fact on HOW she lost.

Frost actions at the end of the fight DO NOT connect with this statement AT ALL.

If you make her fight like a newbie, then don't put statements that she is some sort of Veteran who won a huge amount of victories in a deathmatch fights.

P.S I do not dislike Cassie. I actually don't really dislike any character in MK universe. But in comics so far, Cassie does a lot of surprise headbutts to turn the tables. First Frost and then some Black Dragon soldier. I wonder what would happen if they decided not to put their face near her head? I guess Cassie would be dead by now.

 

[Bruzzrad]

Geez, that's not only biased. That's saltier than the deepest ocean of whale spunk.

 

[Misucra]

Geez, that's not only biased. That's saltier than the deepest ocean of whale spunk.

Person gives a detailed explanation to defend his point. Also doesn't insult another person, nor screams at him (which is physically impossible in forum) gets called "salty".

I guess stating your opinion here is considered "salty" now.

 

[Kitty_55]

I'm a die hard fan of Frost and even I found that to be biased.

 

[Viking_Poodle]

She is completely at Frost mercy. In any other deathmatch this would be finished quickly, but Frost somehow especially for her decided to do monologue. But it is ok. She will say her monologue and freeze Cassie. RIGHT?

She was taunting her, obviously. She let her ego (look at that w/l ratio) get the better of her.