Sandbagging, how do you feel about it?

Critical-Limit

New member
Sandbagging

For those of you who don't know what it means. It's essentially when a player does not play at their best against another opponent for whatever reason.

the most common ones are..
1.) When you're leagues better than your opponent that you just toy with them, which gives them openings and lets them believe they are closer to your level than they really are. This is easiest to know when it's being done to you when you can manage to get them to low life, and suddenly you can't touch them anymore. You're not doing this to be rude, you're just doing this for your OWN amusement. Going for some ridiculous combo, that isn't the right one to use at the moment but you keep going for it just to get it. Stuff like that.

2.) Other reason is just fatigue, Sometimes you played so many games back to back your mind wants to play the game lazy. I personally have been a victim of this and i use to have to constantly mentally slap myself to get refocused.

3.) Intentional to not discourage lower level players, Some people are too nice and don't want to suck the fun out of their opponent by beating them so hard they literally can't do anything but watch a combo video and they are the victim. So the player purposely falls into traps to encourage them a little bit but NEVER lose the game. I'm guilty of this one too, I've tried to get people into fighting games on a competitive level but they get turned away really really quickly if I Rape them too hard. So I ease them in and tell them good job when they do something to encourage them.

4.) For the LoLs: this is probably the most rude way of sandbagging, where you are doing it so obviously, and winning? that you come off as a dick lol. like you were obviously just doing some advance gameplay mechanics earlier int he match... then suddenly changed your style to doing 3 moves in well thought out cycle. Sort of trolling your opponent, and kind of a slap at their face like "I'm way better than you son"

In general the player of lesser skill is normally not the one sandbagging unless it's scenario number 2.


do you guys think some of these methods are ok? Which ones are or not? and why?
 
I should do this more with my friends so they can get better and want to get better. I tend to decimate them a little too much in casual matches.
 
I have done #2 plenty of times mostly when its late at night. I remember one time my bro and I was playing Naruto Clash of Ninja 1 and he told me that I had beaten him and when he turned around I was asleep. To this day I still dont remember doing this but one thing for sure Im a better gamer when Im sleeping =D
 
I kinda do the opposite of #4, but not for lols.

I pretend to suck the first round, just to see how they play.

Then I crank this shit up to 11 and wreck house.
 
well these are my thoughts
1.) I think it's alright, if the better player wants to have fun and spam a combo or something(in a smart way) to try and pull something off sort of using them as a combo dummy, or just doing things they normally wouldn't go for ect ect. As long as the lesser player still can't win, there must be SOMETHING they can still learn. So I believe this is alright morally. The only time it isn't alright morally is when the lower level player asks you personally for a very serious fight. You should oblige them and let them have it. if only for atleast 1 set.

2.) there is no moral to this one, but it hurts many great players. It's hard to maintain hard thinking non-stop, So many things to think about. It's not intentional so if someone calls you out on this, just apologize and let them know you're not sandbagging on purpose, it's a weakness you have.

3.) I use to think this was 100% ok, but now i'm indifferent. Although I do want to bring in more people to the competitive scene, doing it this way TOO hardcore will hurt their growth. It will let them believe something they do is a smart move, when it isn't because you chose not to punish as harshly. On the other hand... you don't want them to give up without trying to better themselves. I know this is ultimately up to them, but this is a fact of the human mind. Some people need guidance to get the right mindset... I'll be honest when I was 14 years old playing SSBM, I was super scrub I would get upset when my friend edgehogged me. ect. But I had a greater player help me get the right mindset and now i'm here today with great wisdom to share with lower level players.

I say this is alright it's just hard to find a balance.

4.) no... It's showboaty and rude. Atleast style on them in style so they can feel good about losing. Losing in a lame way not only embarrasses them, but really discourages them. And if your a pro doing this... well say goodbye to your money lol that's the guy paying ur tournament winnings you just pissed off with his entrance fee.
 
I think number 2 is not anyones fault, we've all done it lol, and number 3 I think is something alot of us do when were trying to help other get better at the game, Cause if you totally destory your friends, more often then not there just gonna stop playing.
 
I think number 2 is not anyones fault, we've all done it lol, and number 3 I think is something alot of us do when were trying to help other get better at the game, Cause if you totally destory your friends, more often then not there just gonna stop playing.

Agreed, but 3 is iffy.

I believe the best remedy to get them into the scene is

1.) be a mentor as the better player
2.) Find them a person of equal skill to them... nothing is better than a rival to keep you motivated to get good.
3.) (Only if you want to go this far.) Suggest going to a tournament, they don't have to enter if they are worried about wasting money.(but i highly advise it) but go to play friendlies with people who also play high level. Hopefully there will be people there who are worse, or friendly high level people. Worse to boost their confidence. the friendly high level thing is weird, because even though YOU may wreck your friend... it's more hurt on them for some reason. if a stranger they don't know destroys them, they feel less hurt by them because They don't know them, aka don't know their skill level. They know YOUR skill level though and if they don't see some sort of improvement fighting you, they feel bad.
4.) Rankings, once they get interested and really addicted to competitive play, their next goal will be to get top 10 in their region.

And for achievements? Such as getting 6 throws in one game?

That's a good point, I guess that would fall under #1. It's avoiding playing top level for your own benefit. But I guess this is a bit of a harder degree of it, because it's #1... but you'll come off as a #4.
 
Agreed, but 3 is iffy.

I believe the best remedy to get them into the scene is

1.) be a mentor as the better player
2.) Find them a person of equal skill to them... nothing is better than a rival to keep you motivated to get good.
3.) (Only if you want to go this far.) Suggest going to a tournament, they don't have to enter if they are worried about wasting money.(but i highly advise it) but go to play friendlies with people who also play high level. Hopefully there will be people there who are worse, or friendly high level people. Worse to boost their confidence. the friendly high level thing is weird, because even though YOU may wreck your friend... it's more hurt on them for some reason. if a stranger they don't know destroys them, they feel less hurt by them because They don't know them, aka don't know their skill level. They know YOUR skill level though and if they don't see some sort of improvement fighting you, they feel bad.
4.) Rankings, once they get interested and really addicted to competitive play, their next goal will be to get top 10 in their region.


.

I strongly agree with you, on your first two points, cause for me I have both, one of my friends is my rival, and I know he pushes me to become better and when he beats me it motivates me to become better so I beat him the next time we fight. As for your third point it is a great idea, but I know for me it's very hard to find any tournaments where I live.
 
1.) When you're leagues better than your opponent that you just toy with them, which gives them openings and lets them believe they are closer to your level than they really are. This is easiest to know when it's being done to you when you can manage to get them to low life, and suddenly you can't touch them anymore. You're not doing this to be rude, you're just doing this for your OWN amusement. Going for some ridiculous combo, that isn't the right one to use at the moment but you keep going for it just to get it. Stuff like that.

This one is pretty dickish. I do find it to be quite funny but not really sportsmanlike.....if you want to make the person feel like they are better than they are, cool, but if you just trick them and then kick their ass into oblivion....ehhhh, you're an *******, lol.

2.) Other reason is just fatigue, Sometimes you played so many games back to back your mind wants to play the game lazy. I personally have been a victim of this and i use to have to constantly mentally slap myself to get refocused.

This is the one I experience more than anything. I usually stay up late and get so into games that I will keep playing, even as my eyes struggle to stay open, so I play like shit.

3.) Intentional to not discourage lower level players, Some people are too nice and don't want to suck the fun out of their opponent by beating them so hard they literally can't do anything but watch a combo video and they are the victim. So the player purposely falls into traps to encourage them a little bit but NEVER lose the game. I'm guilty of this one too, I've tried to get people into fighting games on a competitive level but they get turned away really really quickly if I Rape them too hard. So I ease them in and tell them good job when they do something to encourage them.

This one, I don't mind at all. It feels nice to give someone a boost of confidence in thinking hey, I almost beat that guy, and it encourages them to play more and practice more.

4.) For the LoLs: this is probably the most rude way of sandbagging, where you are doing it so obviously, and winning? that you come off as a dick lol. like you were obviously just doing some advance gameplay mechanics earlier int he match... then suddenly changed your style to doing 3 moves in well thought out cycle. Sort of trolling your opponent, and kind of a slap at their face like "I'm way better than you son"

Anything like this is lame. If you're good, you're good, but having a ****y attitude is just sickening. Play the game, have fun while being competitive, but don't be an ignorant bastard just to be an ignorant bastard. This will just make people not want to play the game.
 
I strongly agree with you, on your first two points, cause for me I have both, one of my friends is my rival, and I know he pushes me to become better and when he beats me it motivates me to become better so I beat him the next time we fight. As for your third point it is a great idea, but I know for me it's very hard to find any tournaments where I live.

Try hosting one yourself :P

It's a little hard and takes some ingenuity but if done well, you can actually profit hosting one.

The only problem is getting enough T.V.'s Setups. I find this best done by offering a discount to the door fee if they bring their own Set up. It's essentially you renting out their setups with their own money lol Genius. (Oh and probably advertising it, aka fliers/facebook/Forums/local game stores.

I have SSBM friends who live in Canada :P, those guys are crazy and drive down to america (like georgia and New York for smash tournaments LOL)
 
with mortal kombat deception/deadly alliance one of my friends and I woudl literally pick characters and fight eachother for hours on end bettering ourselves. got to hte point where we would be trying to read eachother like chess, several moves ahead of where we were at teh moment. it was crazy, i think we pushed the games physics to its limit and started getting things done in such a timeframe that aspects of the game would bugout and do unintended things.

now though...he doesnt want to play mk9 >.<
 
In my opinion, if a person quits a game just because they get decimated, it's probably not worth the effort to keep them around. A competitive player will take a loss as motivation to improve at the game, a player that quits the game altogether after getting ruined a few times is probably more of a casual player that wouldn't take the game seriously on a competitive level anyway.
 
online is fun whether you win some matches by the skin of your teeth or get brutally raped. in this case i've experienced both but the thing i take away from it is how to get better. by no means am i a great player, but there's plenty of room for improvement.
 
In my opinion, if a person quits a game just because they get decimated, it's probably not worth the effort to keep them around. A competitive player will take a loss as motivation to improve at the game, a player that quits the game altogether after getting ruined a few times is probably more of a casual player that wouldn't take the game seriously on a competitive level anyway.

some people don't know what they want. like I said I use to be really scrubby. I even use to convince my friends to let me back on the stage in super smash brothers melee cuz I called edgeguarding cheap. But if a few certain people didn't push me to think "correctly" I would not have the fun I am having now at a advanced thinking level for games in general. I would probably still be one of those whiney casuals.

I guess I feel like I owe it to the guy who did that for me... that I want everyone to be "saved" like I was. I understand your thinking. I agree it does not apply to whiney babies online. most of those guys will never change, but there are some people who are whiney... but if you just put out a gentle hand and talk a bit and help them out. They will think "this guy is cool" they try to improve themselves and you guide them down the path to have a good mindset about playing the game.

I played a match online not too long ago, The guy sent me some hate mail. "you have no life." Instead of ignoring it. I just sent him back a message "would you like me to teach you?" I was expecting a "NO THANKS I HAVE A LIFE NUB" but I instead got a invite. And I got him to be a little less of a queer by being friendly and telling him about mindsets and we got into a deep discussion and I think I better'd him. And I bet that guy is very grateful. I gave him a gift that keeps on giving.

online is fun whether you win some matches by the skin of your teeth or get brutally raped. in this case i've experienced both but the thing i take away from it is how to get better. by no means am i a great player, but there's plenty of room for improvement.

Lets play sometime I'll teach you some things.
My PSN is Critical__Limit Double underscore.


EDIT:
Anything like this is lame. If you're good, you're good, but having a ****y attitude is just sickening. Play the game, have fun while being competitive, but don't be an ignorant bastard just to be an ignorant bastard. This will just make people not want to play the game.
this is the reaction I expect most people to have to that. But believe it or not. I've seen a lot of defense for this type of behavior. Some people say it's good for the "Scene" to have enemies/bad people that good people want to beat. Or people saying it makes good "T.V." aka livestreams, or things like GSL.

good example is Dark prince (Is that his name?) from the Marvel Vs capcom 2 community, That guy gets ALOT of attention because he's such a douche. and people defending that sort of behavior say it brings "interest" to the game. I for one... don't give 2 shits about someone behaving like that. It RUINS it for me. Do I enjoy watching them get their ass beat? Sure... but I'd much rather watch 2 people "I think are cool" fight eachother and give eachother a No Homo man hug after grand finals, It intrigues me to see respect like that.
 
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You know what really sucks? I was destroying this Kratos player with my Nightwolf, but he was not a bad Kratos player in my opinion, Kratos is just a bad, horrible character to fight against Nightwolf for many reasons and I let him win a game after many easy wins from my part, because I really didn't want to smash his fun and I was hoping he would just pick another character. You know what that guy did after that? Sent me a message: "your noob" and left. Sad, pretty sad.
 
I'm a fatigue Sandbagging player sometimes, playing for hours, so, I go for a lower level skill and just start to exchange punch and kicks randomly, and put low or none effort to win, and, not focusing in try my best ..... today I was winning against a dude , sort of 16 in a row, and , suddenly, started to lose concentration and so, the guy won 4 in a row against me, and, him, was clearly a newbie, but, I don't care, let the guy be happy winning too, he deserves, he was not playing Sandbagging, he was trying to win despite his lack of skill, so, after that, we played more, I winning kinda 2, next he winning 1, and so, I could have put more effort and destroyed him, but, was so tired from a hard day work in my job that I thought "**** off", "Screw that" "I don't care about today, so, let's have fun here, playing as newbies, hehe", we finished playing more 10 or 12 games, and he acumulated some wins over me ..... I don't care about loss in this game.... so, Sandbagging happens more often and common than we can imagine .....
 
The point is, I see some players, with more than 2000 vs games done, and , with a good win : ratio overall, but, I know these players are better than me, because, they pratically spend all day long in that MK rooms, playing a lot ..... a guy with 1001 wins, and 135 loses, just challenged me, and , we played 26 games, he won 16 and me, 10, but, even winning more and clearly, being more skilled , the douchebag loser sent me a message saying "Thanks for the fun time, weak stupid ...."...... well, I , instead of do the same mediocrity he did, and, I could easily had chose to sent a message kinda "wow, you play this shit all day long, has 5 times more wins and half my losses than me, and even this way, I defeated you 10 times, so, you are the crap here , dude ! ..... " .... but, nope, I just blocked him in PSN, and let life go on ...... I think he thought he was sanbagging and not doing his best, because next, every other dudes he was beating 10 or 15 in a row, he went public in chat in room and writing stuff as "you all suck balls, noobs" "lol, so easy , weak" and stupid ******** like this ..... lol, lol XD XD
 
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i did the ultimate sandbag when i was trying to get the "Let timer run out in both rounds in a ranked match" achievement... i got his health down to like 5%, and start just jumping around and blocking for the rest of the 90 secs, and he couldnt touch me lol. i actually tried it twice before him, and they kept rage-quitting, im surprised he didnt lol
 
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