Mortal Kombat HD Remix with MUGEN

arq_hawkin

New member
Looks great MG! I love it :)

Just 1 thing, remember that Bleed and Cal are working and rendering under Max, and all characters have to looks under the same quality, right now looks like Kano is going to looks better that Scorpion and Sub-zero.

I don't really think they will look worst, scorpion and sub-zero are amazing just the way they are, Kano will be more detailed because he is not as covered as the ninjas. the main problem is that gojira is working on maya and bleed, cal and I are working on max but gojira won't rigg it or animate it, he will hand it to someone else maybe to bleed and bleed is using max, not maya. So everything gojira is doing maybe will be kind of lost, or maybe not since maya and max are both from autodesk.
 

badmouse

New member
All the characters need to have the same lighting and quality.

I.E, scorpion is missing the high light from the back.
Another example is the SSS shader in the skin of Liu Kang and in the old version of Sonya.

I don't know what shader use scorpion for the skin, but looks like is a phong or similar shader with out the translucence of the SSS shader. This have influence in body part shadow colors. face, arms...

The same render and shader setting is necessary for all characters. Keep the same level for all. Make some character in better quality that others is a big mistake and never seen in other professorial games.

Mixing characters in different quality will make the game looks cheap like other mugen games.

That's my opinion. You guy are who are modeling, animating and rendering the characters so if you guys think will be fine, I respect this.
 
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arq_hawkin

New member
This can be achieve if there is just one person for every step in the character production, some body sculpting, another one polypainting, another one rigging and skinning and someone just animating and rendering, if this is a fan project where every one is contributing is kind of hard to do it. I really know what you mean but is a crime lowering kano's quality but it's a bigger crime to force bleed to redo all the sprites from scorpion and sub-zero, the back light? Well we won't be able to have it in our characters I guess, I don't know what bleed and cal thinks!!
 

calactyte

Active member
Ultimately, despite everyones individual efforts, Bleed will likely do the final pass of rendering and animation on every character. He will likely start at the zBrush level and then retopo/ rig from there. But by getting the models to a nice starting point like they are now we hugely reduce his work load. So in thd end I dont believe quality variance will be very noticable.
 

smoke.tetsu

New member
I know some of you may disagree with me.. but I think you could probably achieve a similar effect for the highlighting one sees in the original sprite with HDR\Bloom and or maybe some application of rim lighting. You could turn it up to whatever level is necessary to achieve the effect. The source engine for example uses Phong Fresnel to achieve rim lighting.

Actually, most of what's going on in MK1 seems to be rim lighting for the most part.... except for maybe the ninja vests which is perhaps SSS with a semi-translucent material. Of course if you examine the original sprites you'd see this happens to varying degrees depending on character and animation so it'd be easy to overdo it.

Of course this would probably have to be baked in considering MUGEN is not 3D.

Lastly, it's probably a good idea to have Bleed do the final pass on all the models irrespective of who did the sculpting to give them consistency.
 
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Jiggeh

New member
The new material for Kano's faceplate looks great. A vast improvement for sure.

For the hair, is it really necessary to bother with the fiber stuff? Since it's so short I would imagine simply having it as a painted texture would work fine. It sounds like it would be way less taxing and I doubt it'd really look much worse anyhow. Then again I have no experience with that sort of thing, maybe it could be baked into the textures?


When it comes to the quality of the final sprites, of course some degree of consistency is desirable, but it likely won't be 100%. Even if Bleed did everything himself from start to finish, just from experience and learning from mistakes, by the time he got to the last character things would probably have changed quite a bit. Having said that, it's probably a very good idea to make sure that the sprites for all characters are rendered under the same lighting and camera conditions. I guess it might also be a good idea to not try and push the fidelity of, say, the skin textures to infinity and beyond, if it means each character will look better than the last -- reaching a certain level and accepting what it looks like, and then moving on might help with the consistency, not to mention of course prevent someone from being bogged down with the same task forever not making any real progress. On the other hand, if the (hypothetical) later, more realistic looking skin textures etc are simple enough to replicate, it probably would not be too much work to redo some of these things on older characters and re-render the sprites. Time consuming, possibly, but not too much work, I would think.

Of course in the end it's completely up to the artists actually working on the characters. But those are my two cents on the subject.
 

UNREALWINS

New member
Yesterday I had problems all day with my ISP. But now resolved, I'll post a picture of suggestion for versus screen:

MK_61.jpg
 

calactyte

Active member
Thank for your contribution UNREALWINS. You definitely have some skill there. Here is my thoughts on your new battle plan.

First, I like the new emblem for the champion medal especially the lense flare.
I think the texture and pattern changes are a bit over done in the stone though. The cracks are pretty nice and I like how they lead your eye to the content.
I don't like outlined text. You seem to do that often and it strikes me as comic book styled and not subtle enough. Of course it really depends on how you are choosing to look at this project. As a "purist" it seems over done especially since the text already reads quite well on the stone backdrop. Anyway, that's my two cents.


Yesterday I had problems all day with my ISP. But now resolved, I'll post a picture of suggestion for versus screen:

MK_61.jpg
 

UNREALWINS

New member
Thank for your contribution UNREALWINS. You definitely have some skill there. Here is my thoughts on your new battle plan.

First, I like the new emblem for the champion medal especially the lense flare.
I think the texture and pattern changes are a bit over done in the stone though. The cracks are pretty nice and I like how they lead your eye to the content.
I don't like outlined text. You seem to do that often and it strikes me as comic book styled and not subtle enough. Of course it really depends on how you are choosing to look at this project. As a "purist" it seems over done especially since the text already reads quite well on the stone backdrop. Anyway, that's my two cents.

Thanks calactyte. So, I really want this project to be the best possible keeping the essence of the details of the original game. I really want to help in what i can. I made some changes on the screen versus screen to keep it close to the original:

MK_62.jpg

HD

nRXER9g.jpg

Original
 

arq_hawkin

New member
Thanks calactyte. So, I really want this project to be the best possible keeping the essence of the details of the original game. I really want to help in what i can. I made some changes on the screen versus screen to keep it close to the original:

MK_62.jpg


it's looking great unreal, but I got two things to say.... why is the dragon logo mirrored?? and can you desature the stone texture??


good job with the versus screen
 

calactyte

Active member
Hey UNREALWINS

I don't want to discourage you showcasing your creativity here, but It would be irresponsible of me if I didn't let you know that the screens you are making have already been created in HD.


In original MK1 the logo is mirrored, look in previous post.

New texture stone:

vYSK0xU.jpg

Without shadow besides pictures

yziBual.jpg

With shadow besides pictures
 

smoke.tetsu

New member
Just some constructive criticism here. I think the ribbon looks too rough especially the font on it. Actually, it's probably mostly down to the font. But also the ribbon in the original looks more to me like it was cut with pinking sheers giving it an outer pattern rather than frayed around the edges.

In the original the top part of the ribbon seems a bit wider making the tapering towards the medal seem more pronounced to me. There also seems to be some bunching up of the ribbon where it tapers towards the medal in the original.

Also the area with the word "champ" on it seems to be a bit thicker than the lower part since in the original it seems to be a bit more raised with a shadow underneath. Possibly due to there being something embedded in it it to mount it to the stone like a piece of metal with whatever would be used to mount it on there attached. I think the material in general is probably also a bit more thicker or more heavy duty than what you have there in general.

The stripy texture running through it also doesn't seem to be so much as slanted as you have it. In general the fabric of the original ribbon looks more "expensive" to me.... and in yours it looks more like scraps... no offense.

The medal itself looks good if not a bit too bright in the kind of metal you are simulating compared to the original.

Of course all of this is subjective and I have to admit partly my interpretation based on a low res image.

Also Calactyte is right that those screens have already been made I'm afraid.
 
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UNREALWINS

New member
Hey UNREALWINS

I don't want to discourage you showcasing your creativity here, but It would be irresponsible of me if I didn't let you know that the screens you are making have already been created in HD.

Damn. Thanks for the warning. ^^

Can anyone show us how it's the final version?
 

calactyte

Active member
I'd prefer not to at this point since I really don't want this to become about voting on what is better or worse which is exactly what this will turn into. Rest assuredly though we went through a lengthy review process and the community mostly thought that everything looked pretty good. Imagine for a second the chaos that was created with just a few simple screenshots that I posted of the W.I.P as it related to the life bars. We are going to make a change there, which everyone seems to be on board with but I would prefer not to go through all of that again (except this time with several screens) instead of 1 graphic.



Damn. Thanks for the warning. ^^

Can anyone show us how it's the final version?
 
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