Your wishlist of Characters from MK4-MKA, prototypes, glitched and new for MK10

And why does that not apply to both Bi Han and Kuai liang?


Because Bi-Han is a whole other being named Noob Saibot now that's why. I thought I explained that in my last post? I'm not arguing this with you anymore. It's clear you want to argue, but I'm done. I told you why I don't even feel it's logical to bring back Bi-han as Sub-Zero and I've listed many reasons why it would be much more likely for Kuai Liang to stay Sub-Zero.

The major points are though:

1. Whether Cyber or Not, Kuai Liang is still Sub-Zero. He's not one of Quan's creations like Scorpion or Noob Saibot are. He's still just Sub-Zero. Just like when Liu Kang died he was still Liu Kang just zombified.

2. I also stated that if Bi-han is to return as Sub-Zero then Noob Saibot has to die because they are not different people. They are the same.

That's really the only points I need covered. There doesn't have to be a human Sub-Zero in the next game he could be an alt. I'm not going to go screaming in the streets "Cop Out" though if they get brought back to life and Kuai Liang is in his human form though because to me it makes sense. Same with Jax and Kabal. THey could actually do this to Jax too and then just have him get his implants to wear. Kabal's deformities could even be healed as well. Although I don't know how much that would help his character?
 
Okay. That'll do. But what fighters would suit these powers?
- Intangibility
- Astral Projection
- Time Travel
- Accelerated Probability - Prediction
- Poisons
- Illusion
- Exoskeleton
- Creature Summoning
- Dimensions
- Spatial Manipulation/Spatial Slicing
- Time
- Metal
- Wood
- Plants
- Gravity
- Ghost/Phantasm/Ghoul

Time = Taven (Can stop time.)
Creature Summoning = Quan Chi and Shinnok
Metal = Sektor and Cyrax
Ghost/Phantasm/Ghoul = Any of the characters that dies in MK9. (Nightwolf or Sindel)

New Character:
A female type of Nightwolf. Someone who is related to Nightwolf, who looks kind of like Julia Chang from Tekken. Her powers would be similar to Nightwolf's too but in her own unique style.
 
Not true.
Ed Boon said it himself that "one is Noob, the other is Saibot."

It is true whether you guys believe it or not.

Ed Boon also said that MK8 was going to be a return to MK glory. We got MKvsDC. That's just one of the many things he's said in the past that wasn't true or he was just purely messing around.

You can't convince me that the statement you provided above is nothing more than him trolling that Noob = Boon and Saibot = Tobias. He was joking, that's all.
 
It is true whether you guys believe it or not.

Ed Boon also said that MK8 was going to be a return to MK glory. We got MKvsDC. That's just one of the many things he's said in the past that wasn't true or he was just purely messing around.

You can't convince me that the statement you provided above is nothing more than him trolling that Noob = Boon and Saibot = Tobias. He was joking, that's all.
Good point, but you could have used a better example; he was actually being truthful when he said what he said about MK8, it was because of Midway that it became DC Universe instead
 
Good point, but you could have used a better example; he was actually being truthful when he said what he said about MK8, it was because of Midway that it became DC Universe instead

Yeah, there are numerous examples of him messing around with fans. That just popped into my mind first. Although days before the announcement of MKvsDC he was still playing it up as if it was going to be the best MK since sliced bread. That didn't happen though and he had to have known by then. It's neither here nor there though. I was just using an example of how Boon messes with fans. If people have not learned to take him so literal by now then I don't know if they will.

@Nasty freak. I actually like the yellow, and it differentiates him from Cyber Sub-Zero (Oh god I hate him).lol. If you color him with light blue or aqua then the two may look too similar.
 
Last edited:
Good point, but you could have used a better example; he was actually being truthful when he said what he said about MK8, it was because of Midway that it became DC Universe instead

Agreed.

Yeah, there are numerous examples of him messing around with fans. That just popped into my mind first. Although days before the announcement of MKvsDC he was still playing it up as if it was going to be the best MK since sliced bread. That didn't happen though and he had to have known by then. It's neither here nor there though. I was just using an example of how Boon messes with fans. If people have not learned to take him so literal by now then I don't know if they will.

MKvsDC was a bad example regardless, because Midway was going broke, so they tried to team up with DC, to try to save their ass.
If the game would have sold well, we would have gotten Quan Chi and Harley Quinn as DLC, and people would be singing a different tune.
Boon is not a prophet and can't predict the future of game sales.
I'm sure if he knew that it was going to get a shitty reception, Midway wouldn't have put it out in the first place.


I know that Boon does tend to troll, but he's also serious about certain things like Scorpion being his favorite character, Kenshi being his 2nd favorite character, him hating Hsu Hao, Chameleon and Khameleon.
He was also serious about MK9 being a retelling of the MK1 thru UMK3 story, that 1 character who wasn't cyber before may be cyber now (Sub-Zero), Kratos being in MK9 on PS3, Klassic costumes for the male and female ninjas.


He has been serious about certain things, so Noob and Saibot may indeed be 2 entities (Bi-Han's soul) and (a NetherRealm soul).
You don't like that possibility because you think it potentially kicks out Kuai-Liang as Sub-Zero, which may or may not be true.
 
It is true whether you guys believe it or not.

Ed Boon also said that MK8 was going to be a return to MK glory. We got MKvsDC. That's just one of the many things he's said in the past that wasn't true or he was just purely messing around.

You can't convince me that the statement you provided above is nothing more than him trolling that Noob = Boon and Saibot = Tobias. He was joking, that's all.

No he was not. look at the example you gave.

Boon + Tobias= Noob Saibot

It has always been "two" people from it's conception. You have Bi Han then Noob, a creation of the dead body that was reanimated by Quan Chi, and made Perfect By adding to Bi Han.

Take scorpion as an example. Has the same done to him, he was revived by Quan chi, but retained "All" his abilities. Then we have Bi Han who didn't? Why? Would that Be unless BI han had souls added to him that had the abilities he currently has now.

Then let's take the split of Boon and Tobias. They tried just calling him noob and it didn't go over to well. We can also take his character from MkD, he was shown to be "HUMAN" and teamed With robot Smoke. Now with the changes set by MK9, it could help tell why he was human. Again there.

This would be Super cool, BI Han teaching Kuai liang how to be a better Sub Zero, it not only helps expand thier story but gives both Depth and that family bond we have never seen. He becomes human again through the soulnado and is put infront of the elder gods for judgement. They show Bi han what his careless actions did to his brother's soul; he see's Kuai liang's soul being manipulated and asks the Elder gods to save him and in return he'll train him to help Raiden. they could say "why sould we do that?" He could say something like; "Even in my perfected form and being Fused with Saibot. My brother defeated me. He could do far more good then I could if I was restored to my original self." And through their training Bi han tell's Kuai liang of their Outworld origin and of their sister, who could turn out to be "frost." all this knowledge he could have gained from being perfected by Quan Chi.

It add's so much to both character's. And if I could come up with that possibilty by just using what already happend. Just think what Nrs could do with it.

Oh Bi han could take the place of Bo' ri' cho. In being the teacher character. Given the serious tone MK9 has set He fit's better then that joke Character would. IMO.

And since you want to use the concept thing for Kuai liang being the true Sub zero, take Havik who was originally supposed to be Noob Saibot in MKD. Going off what you said. Why can't saibot fuse with Havik?
 
Last edited:
I'm through reading anything that has to do with Bi-han and Noob Saibot seperating. I've already said I don't believe it, and nobody is changing my mind. I even said that Bi-Han becoming Sub-Zero is just whatever. I would hate it, but whatever. I would not accept it that way though because Noob Saibot and Bi-Han are the same person. I'm not reading page long rants, and I'm pretty much just done arguing it because the idea just isn't good.

If you want Bi-han to be Sub-Zero again fine. Just come up with a better way than that. Noob Saibot would have to die in order for it to happen though. Just as everyone says they made Cyber Sub-Zero and they have to stick with it, well they made Bi-han Noob Saibot and I say they have to stick with that. Even more so because I think it was planned WAAAAY ahead even further back than MK4 possibly so I believe Bi-Han is Noob Saibot. I'm sorry you're just not convincing me otherwise.

Also, I'll leave you with this. If you seperate Noob Saibot you still have Noob and Saibot. Neither of which equates to Bi-Han. So Boon's little joke on twitter that ya'll are taking to heart is even further moot to me.

@ Ames

Your Scorpion example is a really bad example because as far as we know Scorpion didn't have any 'abilities' in life. He was just a ninja. Bi-han was a cryomancer who died and as a result didn't have those powers anymore. Quan Chi bestowed powers onto BOTH of them. Scorpion with the ability to manipulate fire and Noob Saibot with the ability to manipulate shadows. They have never quite clarified why Bi-Han lost his powers, but maybe it's just a result of death or being sent to the netherrealm. I'm pretty sure that Scorpion never had powers in life though. He was just a ninja. So this is a bad example.

They also never tried just calling him Noob. His name was still Noob Saibot and I believe his Deception bio clarifies that. The creators just didn't want to take up the whole health bar with Noob Saibot-Smoke. I don't know where you get he was human teaming with Smoke either? He was still same old Noob Saibot when he teamed with Smoke????

Also what careless actions did Bi-han do to effect Kuai Liang? He just talked down to him when they fought. Probably because he was pissed that he's a demon and Kuai Liang was still alive.

Also, you can't fuse Noob Saibot with Havik:
1. Because Bi-Han is Noob Saibot
2. Because I'm f'ng tired of taking characters and making them into completely different things entirely. Turning characters into things that don't even remotely look like what they should look like pisses fans off. AKA cyber sub-zero or cyber smoke or for some even Noob Saibot. Stop doing it. Havik is cool how he is no need to be ruining him with putting some symbiote on him.

Also, I like Bo Rai Cho and think he's a cool character. He just wasn't executed well. The farts and fat jokes are just horrible. Give him throwing molotovs as a projectile. Give him his drunken style, and make him a little more serious, but still funny. He in all aspects is a good character though.
 
Last edited:
Wow. Dude. Do you not understand why Kuai liang is even Sub zero and why he went to the tournament?

"To avenge his brother and find his killer." Everything that happens to Kuai liang is Bi hans fault.

No. It wasn't Bi Han, Kuai liang's brother talking down to him it was Noob saibot the corrupted manipulated wraith talking down to him. For all we know Bi han could have really cared for his brother. Who know's.

and it's not Bi han and Noob saibot, it's Noob and Saibot.

It's funny, because we've given many possible out comes for what should happen to Noob saibot now that he's been kicked into a soulnado. Yeah we've said you can't just go poof and CSZ is human again, the difference between Bi han and Kuai liang is one just died, change to him shouldn't happen quickly. Bi han was kicked into a Soulnado something has to happen to him. Because not only did he get kicked into it, it imploded because of it.
 
Wow. Dude. Do you not understand why Kuai liang is even Sub zero and why he went to the tournament?

"To avenge his brother and find his killer." Everything that happens to Kuai liang is Bi hans fault.

No. It wasn't Bi Han, Kuai liang's brother talking down to him it was Noob saibot the corrupted manipulated wraith talking down to him. For all we know Bi han could have really cared for his brother. Who know's.

And it's not Bi han and Noob saibot, it's Noob and Saibot. I said Noob but meant saibot.

It's funny, because we've given many possible out comes for what should happen to Noob saibot now that he's been kicked into a soulnado. Yeah we've said you can't just go poof and CSZ is human again, the difference between Bi han and Kuai liang is one just died, change to him shouldn't happen quickly. Bi han was kicked into a Soulnado something has to happen to him. Because not only did he get kicked into it, it imploded because of it.
 
I'd like to see a variation of Reptile. Like, there's ninja Reptile and there's his true form, far more powerful (something like human - dinosaur - snake combo) with hypnotic powers and able to throw poison all around. Kind of like King Hiss from Masters of the Universe. This new character should be unlockable or something. Like human Smoke was in UMK3. As for Noob Saibot - Sub-Zero discussion, I figure Noob could take a human Sub form via code or whatever. That way we could have both human and robo Sub. When it comes to original chars, I would like to see some monster aliens. We never had space monsters in MKs. There could also be some guy made out of stone (could be Tremor, why not?), slow but strong as hell (boss or sub-boss). Mutants could also be interesting. We could have this guy with another guy growing out of his belly or some horror like that. Or cyborg with a cannon for a hand and extendable limbs. I dunno, what do you guys think?
 
Oh, yeah: and we could have a dude made entirely out of s*it! A joke character who throws s*it at the opponents! I don't know about everyone else, but I think that this guy would rock!
 
Wow. Dude. Do you not understand why Kuai liang is even Sub zero and why he went to the tournament?

"To avenge his brother and find his killer." Everything that happens to Kuai liang is Bi hans fault.

No. It wasn't Bi Han, Kuai liang's brother talking down to him it was Noob saibot the corrupted manipulated wraith talking down to him. For all we know Bi han could have really cared for his brother. Who know's.

and it's not Bi han and Noob saibot, it's Noob and Saibot.

It's funny, because we've given many possible out comes for what should happen to Noob saibot now that he's been kicked into a soulnado. Yeah we've said you can't just go poof and CSZ is human again, the difference between Bi han and Kuai liang is one just died, change to him shouldn't happen quickly. Bi han was kicked into a Soulnado something has to happen to him. Because not only did he get kicked into it, it imploded because of it.

I see ur point on him going to the tournament now I didn't fully understand what u were saying.

However you obviously didn't fully read my post or u misunderstood me. I clearly said that even if Noob Saibot was split it would still b noob and saibot neither of which is bi Han. Which is why the whole there's noob and there's saibot thing doesn't make any sense. Think about it this way. Noob saibot has the power to control shadows. That's his ability. Would it not make sense that his own shadow acts almost as another limb or person for him? That doesn't mean that noob saibot is two different ppl tho. He's just using his shadow for his benefit because he controls shadows. Just because u have a shadow does that mean u can b seperatex from it? No.

Also in defense of kuai liang as sub-zero again. Kuai liang like I said is the true sub-zero. Most ppl know him as sub-zero. A good comparison is green lantern. Think about it. Barry Allen I believe (not sure on the name) was the first green lantern. However everyone knows Hal Jordan as the main green lantern and he came second. My point is just bcuz kuai liang came second doesn't mean he's not the real sub-zero. I'm pretty sure that 19 years as sub-zero qualifies him to b able to brand himself as sub-zero. Bi-Han has spent the better part of his lifespan now as noob saibot. Each character holds there own spot in the franchise respectively.

When all is said and done cyber sub-zero will, most likely, end up a bad memory. Sub-zero and noob saibot however are icons for the franchise. No use in ruining one of them by taking away their identity.
 
I see ur point on him going to the tournament now I didn't fully understand what u were saying.

However you obviously didn't fully read my post or u misunderstood me. I clearly said that even if Noob Saibot was split it would still b noob and saibot neither of which is bi Han. Which is why the whole there's noob and there's saibot thing doesn't make any sense. Think about it this way. Noob saibot has the power to control shadows. That's his ability. Would it not make sense that his own shadow acts almost as another limb or person for him? That doesn't mean that noob saibot is two different ppl tho. He's just using his shadow for his benefit because he controls shadows. Just because u have a shadow does that mean u can b seperatex from it? No.

Also in defense of kuai liang as sub-zero again. Kuai liang like I said is the true sub-zero. Most ppl know him as sub-zero. A good comparison is green lantern. Think about it. Barry Allen I believe (not sure on the name) was the first green lantern. However everyone knows Hal Jordan as the main green lantern and he came second. My point is just bcuz kuai liang came second doesn't mean he's not the real sub-zero. I'm pretty sure that 19 years as sub-zero qualifies him to b able to brand himself as sub-zero. Bi-Han has spent the better part of his lifespan now as noob saibot. Each character holds there own spot in the franchise respectively.

When all is said and done cyber sub-zero will, most likely, end up a bad memory. Sub-zero and noob saibot however are icons for the franchise. No use in ruining one of them by taking away their identity.


There's one thing that speaks against that. If it was his shadow he could throw as many as he wanted because people have more then one shadow, depending on what light where the light is coming from.

You keep saying they couldn't exist without eachother but we have "No idea" what soul got infused with Bi han's body and just how powerful it is. Noob also told CSZ that they shired blood but they where not brothers. This could mean many things, that Bi Hans just a puppet to Saibot or he is infact Bi Han just a shadow of what he used to be.

And 19 years as a cop doesn't make you the "Cop." Bi han may have only been Sub Zero in 3 games that doesn't make him any less Sub Zero then kuai liang. Because in story Bi Han was Sub Zero since he was taken as a kid that was what 27 years before he died in Mk1. Like I said before most people had no clue Bi han was kill and His brother took over untill it was put directly into the story in later games. Most just seen him as Sub Zero. So it's not Kuai liang that has the fan following it's Sub Zero that has the following, same for Noob saibot.

Plus Kuai liang didn't really do anything that made him more popular then Bi han killing Scorpion did. it was that that made them both uber popular.
 
There's one thing that speaks against that. If it was his shadow he could throw as many as he wanted because people have more then one shadow, depending on what light where the light is coming from.

You keep saying they couldn't exist without eachother but we have "No idea" what soul got infused with Bi han's body and just how powerful it is. Noob also told CSZ that they shired blood but they where not brothers. This could mean many things, that Bi Hans just a puppet to Saibot or he is infact Bi Han just a shadow of what he used to be.

And 19 years as a cop doesn't make you the "Cop." Bi han may have only been Sub Zero in 3 games that doesn't make him any less Sub Zero then kuai liang. Because in story Bi Han was Sub Zero since he was taken as a kid that was what 27 years before he died in Mk1. Like I said before most people had no clue Bi han was kill and His brother took over untill it was put directly into the story in later games. Most just seen him as Sub Zero. So it's not Kuai liang that has the fan following it's Sub Zero that has the following, same for Noob saibot.

Plus Kuai liang didn't really do anything that made him more popular then Bi han killing Scorpion did. it was that that made them both uber popular.

Well that would make sense if there's multiple shadows because his arse spams them all day long.

Here's other facts about Noob that also makes it great that Bi-Han is Noob Saibot.

Raiden warned him that if he did not change his ways he would ultimately descend to the fifth plane of the netherrealm where he would meet a fate not even known to Raiden. Ya know what game that happened in? The awe-inspiring, coveted, award-winning Sub-Zero mythologies (excuse me while I try not to be sarcastic). You know what that fate was? Becoming Noob Saibot. What made it even greater is that he refused to serve Quan Chi in life, but since he didn't change his ways he was forced to serve the brotherhood and Quan Chi in death. He didn't change his ways and was on his way to assassinate Shang Tsung which was just another kill for him. He didn't regret it, and he wasn't going to change. Unfortunately for him he was killed by Scorpion and true to Raiden's words he descended to the fifth plane where the darkness in his soul took over killing any good that was in him. Basically, he deserves to be in hell. His evil overcame him and now he revels in it. He loves being evil. All of this information makes me wonder where you're getting what soul was placed within him? I don't understand that. The darkness in BI-HAN'S OWN SOUL is what makes him Noob Saibot. Nothing was imbedded in him. His own darkness overtook him because he let it.

That's also why he told Sub-Zero "We share blood we are not brothers." It showed just the contrast between the two. Even being turned cyber Kuai Liang still took the good path, he still overcame his obstacles just like he always does. Bi-han couldn't. He didn't change and he became evil as a result. It's a good line because it shows that Yes they share blood, but indeed nothing about them says they are brothers. They are polar opposites, and that's why Kuai Liang will always be the better Sub-Zero to me. He takes the high road even under circumstances that would drag most of us down. Which is quite honestly why a lot of people like Bi-Han because being evil is the cool thing to do now. That line was in no way insisting that a symbiote has control of him though. I don't even know where you would be getting that.

Also, 19 years as a cop may not make you the "Cop", but it makes you damn well respected, and as a character(even though he is just that) Kuai Liang deserves the title of Sub-Zero. Being Sub-Zero in only one of the official fighting games does not allow you to call yourself Sub-zero when your brother has took the name and carried it for the entirety of the franchise with the exception of 1 year. They are not people, but if they were I would say that Kuai Liang deserves that title any day over Bi-Han. Any day of the week.

Killing Scorpion did not make Sub-Zero popular. When it came down to it when I was young the color blue is what made Sub-Zero popular to me. I didn't even know there were two, but as I got older and learned there were two I was naturally just drawn to Kuai Liang. He's took on different forms, been through so much, and now continues to go through so much. I'm telling you Sub-Zero is Kuai Liang. I don't know why I keep arguing this with you though. Tarkatan_Trash does the right thing. He just comes in and leaves a sentence like "Sub-Zero is a trademark of Kuai Liang" and then leaves. That's exactly what I should do, but for some reason I can't help defending my character.

Also ask me this why some of you pick and choose what you want to hear or believe?

Boon says "There is Noob and there is Saibot" and you go into conniptions saying "Ohmagosh you guys they are two people".

However when Raiden says "You are surely more poweful than your brother" in MKvsDc it doesn't count. Even though you know that Boon in all likeliness has to approve the script in order for it to go through.

Also, Kuai Liang straight up beat Bi-Han in story mode. Fair and square. But then you say Oh no that's just how storymode was set up. He can't be more powerful than Bi-Han.

It's crazy. What in the hell has Bi-Han done to deserve this kind of adoration? He literally got killed in Mk1 and became Noob Saibot in MK2. That's the entirety of his story as Sub-Zero besides the dickriders who follow Mythologies like it's the bible. However, as far as the Linear fighting games he's only been THE Sub-Zero in one game. Every game after that Kuai Liang was Sub-Zero.

I just really don't understand where the adoration comes from. It's not warranted, and it's not deserved. He's done nothing to have the amount of fans that he does. Unless you count him as Noob Saibot, and then I could understand it. However, wanting him to be Sub-Zero so bad is just not understood to me, and never will be.
 
Last edited:
Top