Results 1 to 19 of 19

Thread: How to build a ground game.

  1. #1
    Defender of EarthRealm Critical-Limit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Pensacola, Florida
    Age
    33
    Posts
    7,111
    PSN
    Critical-Cookie
    Thanked: 871
    Mentioned
    43 Post(s)

    How to build a ground game.

    Fighting Ames the other day made me want to write this.

    Do you think you rely on jump too much? Offline your jumps will get blown up 100% of the time if they are just blocking. A jump is ment to counter attack a whiff/attack. you can condition them to stop doing big damage anti-airs by doing JiK's or using aerial specials that stop your momentum and or attack them like skarlets dagger.

    Now not to put Ames on blast here, this is serious.

    Ames to be honest the REASON I think you rely so heavily on jumping is the fact that you built your game around kratos.

    Kratos has the most terrible pokes in the game, making a up close confrontational situation undesireable.

    Pick a NON kratos character to build your up close game.

    I'm gonna explain in GENERAL here. Each character is different.

    You got D1.
    D3
    D4
    Sweep
    And some characters have really good normals like Cages F3.

    What you want to do is play footsies to open up an advantage opening. this is how you play footsies with spacing.

    Imagine a bubble around each character like this. Everyone's bubble is a different size.
    Mortal-Kombat-Challenge-Tower-Trailer_9.jpg


    You walk back and forth. Entering and leaving eachother's "danger zones" this is to bait an offense to punish whiffs. Or if you call out they are about to re-approach into your danger zone. You can D4/ or whatever.

    Now D4 for almost everyone is one of the best tools ever. It's USUALLY the poke that gives the most advantage. giving you free upclose standing normal offense on hit. On block it's not as forgiving. And it hits low. meaning if the person wants to blow up your D4, they have to dash into your danger zone, and block low. thus leaving them open for grab or overhead or possibly straight up pressure. If you dash in really close to them while they're crouch blocking they can probably D1 you before you start up standing normal pressure.


    D1/D3 is usually the poke you do to counter poke, or poke yourself to snuff normals. If you block one of these you should get a free poke back depending on character, thus giving you advantage. And now that you got a little advantage if you do a standing normal and they just poke back witha 6 frame D1. You might get hit out of it again. So some characters need to slowly rise up the ladder to open them up more.

    for instance my Ermac. I do D3, and if I think they'll poke immediately after D3 back at me. I either back dash and whiff punish, or I do a D4 with my advantage and range on D4, to get a huge advantage thus going in with my standing normals.


    Jumping might get you some attacks online, but if you really want to build your MK game, you need to work on a strictly ground game. Jumps are ment to punish medium range attack whiffs like Force push/Net/projectiles, Jade's B3. Cross over JiP, is used to punish a whiff, or to keep pressure when you've conditioned them with Jump kick/specials to block.


    If you watch a CDjr/Perfect Legend match. Sometimes you'll see them just sit there and crouch block in your face for sometimes as long as 3-4 seconds. They are waiting for a poke, so they can counter poke, get advantage then start their offense.

    knowing frame data helps because it's all math. But trial and error can work too if you're annoyed by frame data.




    Try not to jump so much, MK is the MOST unforgiving game when it comes to Anti-air damage.

  2. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Critical-Limit For This Useful Post:


  3. #2
    Defender of EarthRealm iViTal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Mileena
    Posts
    7,303
    Twitter
    @Torey_17
    PSN
    _iApollos
    Steam
    iReality35
    Thanked: 568
    Mentioned
    146 Post(s)

    Re: How to build a ground game.

    Critical, I love you...

    I was going to PM you about this sooner or later lol, it's my biggest problem in every fighter, but this thread can help solve my MK jumping habit :[

    "I Make Violence Look Good"

  4. #3
    Defender of EarthRealm Critical-Limit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Pensacola, Florida
    Age
    33
    Posts
    7,111
    PSN
    Critical-Cookie
    Thanked: 871
    Mentioned
    43 Post(s)

    Re: How to build a ground game.

    Quote Originally Posted by iViTal View Post
    Critical, I love you...

    I was going to PM you about this sooner or later lol, it's my biggest problem in every fighter :[
    The bubble thing is existent in every fighter.

    but D1/D3/D4 is not.

    you do links in street fighter and pressure them. But the back and forth in and out of danger zones is existent in EVERY fighting game.


    The danger zones in smash bros is HUGE.

    because of how fast the characters can move. Captain falcon's danger zone can cover 3/4ths of the Dreamland 64 stage.

  5. #4
    Defender of EarthRealm iViTal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Mileena
    Posts
    7,303
    Twitter
    @Torey_17
    PSN
    _iApollos
    Steam
    iReality35
    Thanked: 568
    Mentioned
    146 Post(s)

    Re: How to build a ground game.

    Damn Lol, So one character can almost control the pace of the entire match in SSBM?!

    and I'm familiar with most of the characters main pokes in SF, along with their ranges but whenever I play, it's like my brain goes into auto pilot mode and I often don't think before making my next move and I often resort to jumping to start my offense instead of just slowly pushing my way towards them to figure out their poking pattern and punishing.

    "I Make Violence Look Good"

  6. #5
    Defender of EarthRealm Critical-Limit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Pensacola, Florida
    Age
    33
    Posts
    7,111
    PSN
    Critical-Cookie
    Thanked: 871
    Mentioned
    43 Post(s)

    Re: How to build a ground game.

    Quote Originally Posted by iViTal View Post
    Damn Lol, So one character can almost control the pace of the entire match in SSBM?!

    and I'm familiar with most of the characters main pokes in SF, along with their ranges but whenever I play, it's like my brain goes into auto pilot mode and I often don't think before making my next move and I often resort to jumping to start my offense instead of just slowly pushing my way towards them to figure out their poking pattern and punishing.
    well depends on the character.

    falcon has a huge danger zone. where he can reach you. but you can also shield in time, or if you're marth youc an hit him out of the air.

  7. #6
    Lin Kuei Assassin Kzaoo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    ENGERLAND! At your nan's house
    Age
    26
    Posts
    2,781
    PSN
    chainedfreedom
    Thanked: 391
    Mentioned
    39 Post(s)

    Re: How to build a ground game.

    You say d4 is not forgiving on block, but aren't they neutral on block?

    Anyway, this is great. A nice summary of footsies and such. I think you should mention dash blocking, because I know people use jumping as a mobility tool.



    MK9 Mains: Kano, Cage, Ermac.
    TTT2 Mains: Violet/Wang

  8. #7
    Defender of EarthRealm iViTal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Mileena
    Posts
    7,303
    Twitter
    @Torey_17
    PSN
    _iApollos
    Steam
    iReality35
    Thanked: 568
    Mentioned
    146 Post(s)

    Re: How to build a ground game.

    o.o

    In your opinion, who has the biggest danger zone in MK?

    "I Make Violence Look Good"

  9. #8
    Defender of EarthRealm Critical-Limit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Pensacola, Florida
    Age
    33
    Posts
    7,111
    PSN
    Critical-Cookie
    Thanked: 871
    Mentioned
    43 Post(s)

    Re: How to build a ground game.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kzaoo View Post
    You say d4 is not forgiving on block, but aren't they neutral on block?

    Anyway, this is great. A nice summary of footsies and such. I think you should mention dash blocking, because I know people use jumping as a mobility tool.
    Not all of them, I get counter poked on D4 all the time.

    hit a blocked down 4, even on nuetral you're probably gonna give up pressure. because D4 startup is slower than D1/D3. meaning to use those, you expose yourself to pokes.


    Edit:

    Some are safe because of their range/cancellability. like if you got a safe special like scorpion, or range like mileena. or cancel into military stance like sonya. you get rewarded for on block or atleast have advantage.

    D4 a johnny cage as noob saibot on his block and tell me you don't regret that decision with his short ass D4.
    Last edited by Critical-Limit; 11-11-2012 at 10:15 AM.

  10. #9
    Defender of EarthRealm Critical-Limit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Pensacola, Florida
    Age
    33
    Posts
    7,111
    PSN
    Critical-Cookie
    Thanked: 871
    Mentioned
    43 Post(s)

    Re: How to build a ground game.

    Quote Originally Posted by iViTal View Post
    o.o

    In your opinion, who has the biggest danger zone in MK?
    Probably Jade, and Skarlet.

  11. #10
    Shaolin Monk
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Dover, NH
    Age
    34
    Posts
    1,777
    Twitter
    @Officialrikolaw
    Xbox Live
    EMPR WC
    PSN
    RikoLaw
    Steam
    RikoLaw
    Thanked: 373
    Mentioned
    8 Post(s)

    Re: How to build a ground game.

    So is Sektor not allowed to jump? I jump with Sektor because people expect me to teleport so they usually don't try to punish. I aslo anti air with his flamethrower instead of d1, d2, or d3 -- should I be switching to one of these instead for advantage? Also, I jump with Mileena now for a low insta-air sai blast because I can block once I land rather than waiting for the recovery frames (just started using this), is this not safe on poke? I thought her knees were high enough to whiff a dashing d4.

  12. #11
    Defender of EarthRealm Critical-Limit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Pensacola, Florida
    Age
    33
    Posts
    7,111
    PSN
    Critical-Cookie
    Thanked: 871
    Mentioned
    43 Post(s)

    Re: How to build a ground game.

    Quote Originally Posted by rikolaw View Post
    So is Sektor not allowed to jump? I jump with Sektor because people expect me to teleport so they usually don't try to punish. I aslo anti air with his flamethrower instead of d1, d2, or d3 -- should I be switching to one of these instead for advantage? Also, I jump with Mileena now for a low insta-air sai blast because I can block once I land rather than waiting for the recovery frames (just started using this), is this not safe on poke? I thought her knees were high enough to whiff a dashing d4.
    as i said this is generally info on building a ground game.

    Even sektor yes, it's dangerous to jump alot.

    Let me explain why.


    1.) He has more options in the air, which means yes you can condition people to behave a certain way, but then you're playing a 50/50 guessing game where if you guess wrong' you're blown up.

    a.) if they anti-air jab combo you, cuz of JiP, that's a full combo. If they jump and do teleport punch(sektor) then you get a combo. If sektor, does teleport punch, but they block. They get a combo. If they block when you jip, you just get pressure.


    both scenarios they guess right they get a combo. only one scenario where you guess right do you get a combo. the other is just pressure.


    now sometime when you jump you might jump over a whiffed move thus giving you a combo like subs' iceball.

    But soem people can jump more than others.

    skarlet can avoid committing to a jump and be 100% safe, so can a few others, like kitana.


    I'm not saying jumping is bad. I'm only saying that it's largely a unsafe decision and it's usually highrisk/high reward. and most of the time not in your favor when the opponent is capable of hard punish anti-airs.

    Quote Originally Posted by rikolaw View Post
    , is this not safe on poke? I thought her knees were high enough to whiff a dashing d4.
    explain I'm confused what you're asking.

  13. #12
    Shaolin Monk
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Dover, NH
    Age
    34
    Posts
    1,777
    Twitter
    @Officialrikolaw
    Xbox Live
    EMPR WC
    PSN
    RikoLaw
    Steam
    RikoLaw
    Thanked: 373
    Mentioned
    8 Post(s)

    Re: How to build a ground game.

    Ah I understand now.

    Clarificaction: Mileena instant air sai blast at its lowest point gives you a block option as soon as the feet hits the ground, I thougnt that if you d1 you'll miss the sai but you wiff the poke allowing Mileena to advance, block, or b dash.

  14. #13
    Elder God YungQ94's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Skull Island w/ Vital & Shira
    Age
    25
    Posts
    12,059
    Twitter
    @#TeamThrowItBack
    Xbox Live
    BiTeThAPiLlOw
    PSN
    YUNGQ94
    Thanked: 870
    Mentioned
    144 Post(s)

    Re: How to build a ground game.

    You inspire me to make a SF thread on ground game Critical
    For the Lin Kuei

  15. #14
    Shaolin Monk
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Dover, NH
    Age
    34
    Posts
    1,777
    Twitter
    @Officialrikolaw
    Xbox Live
    EMPR WC
    PSN
    RikoLaw
    Steam
    RikoLaw
    Thanked: 373
    Mentioned
    8 Post(s)

    Re: How to build a ground game.

    Please do so! I cant believe how many people get blown up by GUILE because of that habit.

  16. #15
    Elder God YungQ94's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Skull Island w/ Vital & Shira
    Age
    25
    Posts
    12,059
    Twitter
    @#TeamThrowItBack
    Xbox Live
    BiTeThAPiLlOw
    PSN
    YUNGQ94
    Thanked: 870
    Mentioned
    144 Post(s)

    Re: How to build a ground game.

    Hmm ok

    It'll take some doing alright, going through some anti airs to use
    For the Lin Kuei

  17. #16
    Lin Kuei Assassin Kzaoo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    ENGERLAND! At your nan's house
    Age
    26
    Posts
    2,781
    PSN
    chainedfreedom
    Thanked: 391
    Mentioned
    39 Post(s)

    Re: How to build a ground game.

    You are the worst culprit for jumping in, boy....



    MK9 Mains: Kano, Cage, Ermac.
    TTT2 Mains: Violet/Wang

  18. #17
    Defender of EarthRealm iViTal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Mileena
    Posts
    7,303
    Twitter
    @Torey_17
    PSN
    _iApollos
    Steam
    iReality35
    Thanked: 568
    Mentioned
    146 Post(s)

    Re: How to build a ground game.



    I remember in one of Yung's SFxT videos against you he was like.

    "I gotta respect Juri's anti Air" *Cross up attempt with Bison*

    "I Make Violence Look Good"

  19. #18
    Elder God YungQ94's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Skull Island w/ Vital & Shira
    Age
    25
    Posts
    12,059
    Twitter
    @#TeamThrowItBack
    Xbox Live
    BiTeThAPiLlOw
    PSN
    YUNGQ94
    Thanked: 870
    Mentioned
    144 Post(s)

    Re: How to build a ground game.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kzaoo View Post
    You are the worst culprit for jumping in, boy....
    That's why I want to make the thread.

    To remind me not to jump so often lol
    For the Lin Kuei

  20. #19
    Defender of EarthRealm Critical-Limit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Pensacola, Florida
    Age
    33
    Posts
    7,111
    PSN
    Critical-Cookie
    Thanked: 871
    Mentioned
    43 Post(s)

    Re: How to build a ground game.

    Quote Originally Posted by rikolaw View Post
    Ah I understand now.

    Clarificaction: Mileena instant air sai blast at its lowest point gives you a block option as soon as the feet hits the ground, I thougnt that if you d1 you'll miss the sai but you wiff the poke allowing Mileena to advance, block, or b dash.
    you can just duck the sais right?

    when I'm Ermac for example, I just block both kicks, D1 her after sai's into lift.

    Even her EX kicks into sai's are unsafe, but your right if you hit the block. with the sai's your safe.

    I can't hit you in time if you EX kicks and do sais on my block.

    Mileena gets blown up by pressure, so she is probably the best person to learn when it come to whiff punishing/poking/prodding. Her zoning is meh, so what she does is she goes in and out of that danger zone the most often to bait stuff. her roll for whiff punish is so good. Also as an anti air.



    Unless yoru talking about non EX kick, into really high sais?

    yeah if I poke and whiff might be safe? depends on move duration.

    But if that's the case I can just wait for you to fall down a little more lol.

    but I've seen kung laos miss thier spin because of super high sais.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. Does MK9 FINAL build support custom music on PS3?
    By MK9 in forum Mortal Kombat (2011) Forum
    Replies: 26
    Last Post: 05-02-2011, 03:36 PM
  2. What's the deal with cinematic throws: are they in the final build?
    By Jakarta in forum Mortal Kombat (2011) Forum
    Replies: 15
    Last Post: 04-06-2011, 05:20 PM
  3. Video Footage from the Final Build of MK vs DCU
    By Jeff Greeson in forum TRMK's Front Page News
    Replies: 14
    Last Post: 10-02-2008, 09:05 PM
  4. IGN Previews Latest MK: Armageddon Build at GC
    By Jeff Greeson in forum TRMK's Front Page News
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 08-24-2006, 10:13 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •