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Thread: Escaping Pressure(Basic Defensive Options FAQ Thread)

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    Hollywood Superstar NothingRhymesWithCircus's Avatar
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    Escaping Pressure(Basic Defensive Options FAQ Thread)

    I posted this on another thread and see that there are actually a couple of threads asking "what to do while getting rushed down" so I decided to make it it's own thread.

    ============================================

    First off, you got to know what you're getting hit by.
    If Liu Kang is in your face you HAVE TO BLOCK LOW. His low 3 hit string that starts his big combo is safe on block so Liu Kang players arent afraid to overuse it. Just remember though, that when you do block it, YOU are at the advantage after blocking it.

    Barely any strings when blocked GIVE advantage to the person getting blocked. Even if the string is safe it still gives the person who blocked a little amount of advantage so they could start their own pressure or do a defensive option.


    ===================================================

    Now you might be asking, "Okay, so I have advantage.... what do I do with it?". Well.... you have to pick one of the defensive options that every character has:


    The basic defensive options in this game are:

    1. Jump away (safest option)

    2. Jump over (goes into combo opportunity if the opponent keeps attacking)

    3. Neutral Jump Punch (If you predict that they want to jump over you, you spike them down and start a juggle)

    4. Down Jab (stops them in their tracks and gives you the advantage on hit and could be canceled into a special move)

    5. Fast Specials (risky because punishable on block. this option should be rarely done)

    6. Down toe tap (fast but not damaging and gives very little advantage on hit and hits low)

    7. Down kick (slowish but gives alot of advantage on hit and hits low)



    The low pokes down jab and toe tap are EVERYONE'S fastest move in the game. Even Kung Lao's spin is the exact same speed as his down jab. This means that if you do decide to interrupt your opponent with an attack, these low pokes are the ones you should go with because they are safe, they are fast, and they begin YOUR pressure.

    Also, because you could cancel downjab into a special move, you could instantly do a safe special or mixup straight from a downjab. Sure, it won't actually combo, but it's a great way to instantly stop your opponent's offense with your own.
    Example: Reptile doing downjab and canceling it straight into an Acid Hand

    Once you master all these options, upclose pressure characters shouldnt be that big of a deal. Just look for those gaps in their pressure and choose one of these defensive options to slip in and catch them off guard. Just takes practice.

    Most people like characters with fast specials because they get a "free get out of pressure" special move. But seriously no character needs a fast special to stop pressure. Fast specials are actually the most risky thing you could do to stop pressure and should be a rare option you pull out.

    The key is to not have your opponent be on the offense at all. This game is all about offense, even when you're zoning. Against a good player, if you're on the constant defense you will lose because they are mixing you up with strings and grabs or w/e... and you're just taking it.

    Learn you're opponent's moves, see where they like to overhead, or do a low, or grab, and find those gaps so you could pull out one of your defensive options.

    Find those gaps and capitalize!


    ====================================================


    How to avoid getting zoned out by projectiles:

    1. Dash Block (Dash in between the projectiles, then block the next one)

    2. Jump Over the projectile (This advances you further than dash blocking does but its more dangerous because you could get anti-aired. Do this when you're opponent isnt expecting it)

    3. Do a special move that avoids projectiles (RISKY!!!!! Don't do this too often because ALL of these moves are punishable on block by full combo. Throw this out when you KNOW it'll hit)
    Example: Kung Lao's Dive kick, Smoke's teleport, Scorpion's teleport, Raiden's EX Supermans


    4. Duck under projectile (Stalls for time, doesn't really benefit getting close to the opponent but does give you time and sometimes makes the opponent anxious enough to approach you if you are close enough)


    The safest of all these options is by far dash blocking. Use it the most you possibly can and mix in the other three options sometimes to throw the opponent off. DON'T ALWAYS JUMP FROM JUMP DISTANCE IT'S REALLY OBVIOUS!. Try dashing into a range where one of your normal strings will land and start pressure like that instead. Only jump in at your opponent when you KNOW that they are doing something and your jump will succeed.

    Also note that in this game dashing could be canceled by ANY MOVE or a block. This means you could backdash or forward dash into a desired position where you know your longest normal move will hit and start your pressure quickly and effectively. Dashing around constantly is perfectly safe because you could block at any point. This makes it so there is no excuse just to turtle and block in one place like a statue and wait for the opponent to come up and mix you up with their attacks. Stay moving, and that doesn't mean jump around like a maniac.




    If you guys have any character specific questions on how to deal with pressure just ask and hopefully someone else or myself will answer it for you.


    Hope this helps everyone
    Last edited by NothingRhymesWithCircus; 06-26-2011 at 07:49 PM.

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    Shaolin Monk yautjared's Avatar
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    Re: Escaping Pressure(Basic Defensive Options FAQ Thread)

    Any Circus MK 2011 tip = Golden value

    XD
    Skarlet : Kunoichi warrior, Kodachi master, Kunai expert.

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    Hollywood Superstar NothingRhymesWithCircus's Avatar
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    Re: Escaping Pressure(Basic Defensive Options FAQ Thread)

    *placeholder post*

    PS: could this get stickied?

    IS KANO GONNA HAVE TO CHOKE A B**CH!?!

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    Shaolin Monk yautjared's Avatar
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    Re: Escaping Pressure(Basic Defensive Options FAQ Thread)

    Another tips :

    - Crouch without block avoid thrown moves

    - As Circus said, while you are "on attack mode" , you are the one not wasting/losing health bar, so, keeping a pure defensive style in this game means = you are a dead player walking !! haha XD

    - Learn to avoid as much as possible the Tick Throw, but, if unavoidable, combat it with the throw cancel, this way, you have less fear for battles taking place in "face-to-face" distance. Daigo Umehara is a master on this kind of game .....
    Last edited by yautjared; 06-22-2011 at 03:07 PM.
    Skarlet : Kunoichi warrior, Kodachi master, Kunai expert.

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    Hollywood Superstar NothingRhymesWithCircus's Avatar
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    Re: Escaping Pressure(Basic Defensive Options FAQ Thread)

    Quote Originally Posted by yautjared View Post
    Another tips :

    - Crouch without block avoid thrown moves

    - As Circus said, while you are "on attack mode" , you are the one not wasting health bar, so, keeping a pure defensive style in this game means = you are a dead player walking !! haha XD

    - Learn to avoid as much as possible the Tick Throw, but, if unavoidable, combat it with the throw cancel, this way, you have less fear for battles taking place in "face-to-face" distance. Daigo Umehara is a master on this kind of game .....
    Added ducking under projectiles to the list, thanks.

    And the best way to avoid tick through is to jump over or jump away. Trying to actually break the grab is just too risky because A) you might guess wrong on which grab it is and B) they might not grab at all and you might press a button when you're not on the adavantage and eat a full combo.

    Tick throwing = poking the opponent with a safe move then immediately grabbing. It's tricky and works more than you might think. It doesnt matter if they block the poke or if it hits, tick throws are GOOD.

    IS KANO GONNA HAVE TO CHOKE A B**CH!?!

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    Shaolin Monk yautjared's Avatar
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    Re: Escaping Pressure(Basic Defensive Options FAQ Thread)

    Summary :

    Defense methods possible in MK 2011 ????

    - Block button (obvious)
    - Backdash
    - Jump backward / Jump forward
    - Neutral jump
    - Pure & simple ..... crouch !!
    - Stopping an attack with another ..... attack ? (frame advantage ?)
    - Teleport move, timing it exactly that split second before you get hit by an attack move (for teleporters characters only, hehe ....)

    Missing something ?

    If I'm wrong , please, correct me.
    Skarlet : Kunoichi warrior, Kodachi master, Kunai expert.

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    Shaolin Monk yautjared's Avatar
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    Re: Escaping Pressure(Basic Defensive Options FAQ Thread)

    Quote Originally Posted by NothingRhymesWithCircus View Post
    Tick throwing = poking the opponent with a safe move then immediately grabbing. It's tricky and works more than you might think. It doesnt matter if they block the poke or if it hits, tick throws are GOOD.
    It's one of your favourite techniques, and you are good with that using Kano. You used a couple of times in CEO 2011 ..... hehe XD. I saw it on the stream video !! XD
    Skarlet : Kunoichi warrior, Kodachi master, Kunai expert.

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    Shaolin Monk 3mag5num7's Avatar
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    Re: Escaping Pressure(Basic Defensive Options FAQ Thread)

    Circus you sweetheart, lol. Great post, man.

    I'd never heard of tick throws. I'd seen it done a bit, but hadn't really tried it out other than off of jump-ins.

    A lot of the defensive stuff in your post is absolutely necessary to anyone who wants to win matches. I've been starting to figure some of it out, but A) it's nice to see I was thinking properly and B) some of this I hadn't really thought of. As someone new to taking fighters seriously, this is a great thread. Thanks =)


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    Lin Kuei Assassin Eks's Avatar
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    Re: Escaping Pressure(Basic Defensive Options FAQ Thread)

    Might wanna add something about dash-cancelling with block for the dash blocking part. Great info all around.`
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    Tarkatan Warrior Matt Wilson's Avatar
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    Re: Escaping Pressure(Basic Defensive Options FAQ Thread)

    I usually TU if someone spams projectiles. I figure after the 3rd one, they're going to keep doing it, so if I keep crouching/blocking they won't expect me to just pull it out. Besides, what is the cool down time on most projectiles from the moment they launch it to when they themselves can block? Like 2 secs?
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    Hollywood Superstar NothingRhymesWithCircus's Avatar
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    Re: Escaping Pressure(Basic Defensive Options FAQ Thread)

    Quote Originally Posted by yautjared View Post
    Summary :

    Defense methods possible in MK 2011 ????

    - Block button (obvious)
    - Backdash
    - Jump backward / Jump forward
    - Neutral jump
    - Pure & simple ..... crouch !!
    - Stopping an attack with another ..... attack ? (frame advantage ?)
    - Teleport move, timing it exactly that split second before you get hit by an attack move (for teleporters characters only, hehe ....)

    Missing something ?

    If I'm wrong , please, correct me.
    Nope that's all of them. But make sure to note that down pokes(down jab and toe tap) are every character's fastest move. Even Kung Lao's spin is the same speed as his down jab. This is why low jab and toe tap are the best attacks to stop pressure.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eks View Post
    Might wanna add something about dash-cancelling with block for the dash blocking part. Great info all around.`
    good idea, thanks.

    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Wilson View Post
    I usually TU if someone spams projectiles. I figure after the 3rd one, they're going to keep doing it, so if I keep crouching/blocking they won't expect me to just pull it out. Besides, what is the cool down time on most projectiles from the moment they launch it to when they themselves can block? Like 2 secs?
    This is actually not a very good idea at all Matt. If they catch onto the fact that you teleport punch after a couple of projectiles they could actually bait YOU into using your teleport punch and block it then YOU will eat a full juggle because teleportpunch is really punishable. Some character's projectiles have alot of recovery time before they could do anything, but alot of characters like Quan Chi and Kano could block very shortly after the projectile leaves their hands.

    You have to use blockdashing and jumping ALOT more often than your teleportpunch because in the end you dont want to avoid a projectile that only does about 8% by doing a teleportpunch that if blocked will make you eat an about 35-45% juggle. It's just not worth the risk and should be done really rarely.

    IS KANO GONNA HAVE TO CHOKE A B**CH!?!

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    Tarkatan Warrior Matt Wilson's Avatar
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    Re: Escaping Pressure(Basic Defensive Options FAQ Thread)

    That's very true, I never thought of it that way. But what if I baited them by jumping over the projectile, but in mid-jump I use TU?
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    Shaolin Monk yautjared's Avatar
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    Re: Escaping Pressure(Basic Defensive Options FAQ Thread)

    I see this topic being one of the most useful here , in TRMK !! XD

    In fact, the lack of knowledge about 2D fighting games defense field, make lots of good rushdowns and agressive players, losing a match some moments later, when, despite their agressive start-initial strategy, they are caught by surprise by players that know how to take advantage in using properly defense tricks.

    So, a thread like this one here is more than welcome !

    XD
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    Shaolin Monk Dedamn666's Avatar
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    Re: Escaping Pressure(Basic Defensive Options FAQ Thread)

    fantastic thanks, defense has been a problem for me, i used to be pretty aggresive, then got defesnive but now ive got too defensive, so i usually get rushed down and loose at the moment, gonna have this thread open tomorrow and and practice your tips man thanks a lot!!

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    Shaolin Monk yautjared's Avatar
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    Re: Escaping Pressure(Basic Defensive Options FAQ Thread)

    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Wilson View Post
    That's very true, I never thought of it that way. But what if I baited them by jumping over the projectile, but in mid-jump I use TU?
    It's a valid try, but, some clever players are expecting to bait you, when exactly you are trying to bait them, so, they try isolated 2 projectiles by time, waiting to see how your reaction goes expecting what they gonna do in their 3rd movement .....
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    Tarkatan Warrior Matt Wilson's Avatar
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    Re: Escaping Pressure(Basic Defensive Options FAQ Thread)

    I normally only have this problem with Scorpion and Noob Saibot players. Sometimes Smoke, but not really. That shadow blitz is a ***** from Noob, and if you try and jump toward him, he can do that up-kick, and if you try to dash, he can teleport grab you. It doesn't always happen this way, but it would be nice to know a solid counter. I've found TU works well if I catch them off guard, but it is punishable.

    Scorpion on the other hand just irritates me. Between that spear, the hellfire when you block, and teleport when you jump, he pisses me off. >.<
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    Hollywood Superstar NothingRhymesWithCircus's Avatar
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    Re: Escaping Pressure(Basic Defensive Options FAQ Thread)

    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Wilson View Post
    That's very true, I never thought of it that way. But what if I baited them by jumping over the projectile, but in mid-jump I use TU?
    Quote Originally Posted by yautjared View Post
    It's a valid try, but, some clever players are expecting to bait you, when exactly you are trying to bait them, so, they try isolated 2 projectiles by time, waiting to see how your reaction goes expecting what they gonna do in their 3rd movement .....
    Exactly.

    Its a viable strategy of course. But don't do it that often AT ALL because its just too risky.

    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Wilson View Post
    I normally only have this problem with Scorpion and Noob Saibot players. Sometimes Smoke, but not really. That shadow blitz is a ***** from Noob, and if you try and jump toward him, he can do that up-kick, and if you try to dash, he can teleport grab you. It doesn't always happen this way, but it would be nice to know a solid counter. I've found TU works well if I catch them off guard, but it is punishable.

    Scorpion on the other hand just irritates me. Between that spear, the hellfire when you block, and teleport when you jump, he pisses me off. >.<
    See in these two instances, Noob and Scorpion, it'd actually be okay for you to jump over a Shadow tackle or spear then teleportuppercut because the recovery time on Shadowtackle and spear are pretty high. But for Noob make sure to time it correctly because it's not THAT much recovery time. Even so even in these cases it shouldnt be done too too often.

    In case you didnt know too. If you block Scorpion's spear from full screen as Sektor, you could actually teleportpunch punish him and he wouldnt be able to block. On block spear is HORRIBLE. So if you know your opponent is spear happy and you are Sektor... just block and teleport punch him everytime.

    IS KANO GONNA HAVE TO CHOKE A B**CH!?!

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    Shaolin Monk yautjared's Avatar
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    Re: Escaping Pressure(Basic Defensive Options FAQ Thread)

    Sektor has a basic 2 hit combo, back + 3, 4, that is good to poke middle screen, while dashing block. Some players forget that, despite the others Sektor pure kick 2 hit combo, this one actually does not need to hit the first move in order to connect the second, and so, some players fall on the second hit ......
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    Re: Escaping Pressure(Basic Defensive Options FAQ Thread)

    Very nice thread.

    I would like to add that armor moves work against careless zoners.

    Scorpion can use his EX spear to absorb a projectile and get a full combo. Liu Kang and Cage can use EX flying kick/shadow kick to go through a projectile and get in your face.

    EDIT: Some armor moves can be also be used to escape pressure, such as Shang's EX soul steal and X-Rays.
    Last edited by MKBlade; 06-22-2011 at 05:31 PM.

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    Re: Escaping Pressure(Basic Defensive Options FAQ Thread)

    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Wilson View Post
    Scorpion on the other hand just irritates me. Between that spear, the hellfire when you block, and teleport when you jump, he pisses me off. >.<
    I agree, Scorpion is the most irritating character in this game. I suck at getting people off me when they just cross-up most of the time since I can't seem to guess what they're about to do. Sometimes they throw, sometimes they just combo, and sometimes they just jump over me and keep me in lock down. Scorpion seems to be the best character for this since he can also throw his specials into the mix giving him more advantage.

    The only thing I can think of is just pressure him back as best you can. I'm not good at pressure since I'm more of a zoner player, but this seems to be the best solution against those Scorpion players.

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