What's a technique they can implement in the next MK to make it a deeper fighter?

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Drakilla

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Street Fighter 3 introduced parrying (IMO the best/most evolved gameplay mechanic in a fighter, so advanced they had to remove it for SFIV to reclaim the casuals).


Street Fighter 4 introduced FADC, which I'm not really a fan of but makes it a hell of a lot more interesting and really separates the hardcore audience from the casuals.


What do you think MK could implement that would fit in its' gameplay system that would cater to a more hardcore audience while still keeping it fun for the casuals? (something SF4 achieved imo)


Maybe a semi-parrying system, kind like Garou's Just Defend. Something that would up the ante for smarter, more technical defensive play. >_>
 
Well for one they need to not make X Rays so easy to pull off. I also don't think they should have super armor. The wake up game needs to be re done because it's ass in this game.

But in terms of something new and unique...Bring back multi layered arenas
throws could be more technical
make every character unique like size, speed, health, and damage wise
but first learn to actually balance the game because currently it's laughable.

I think ground combat would be good, when you are on your back you hold down and press any attack button to kick them away to get distance for a safe wake up.
 
Probably some kind of counter : back + block.

Just make the timing really tight and maybe with the first hit only, breaker would need to be used any hit after that.

edit: yeah also I would prefer that X-rays have their own command for each character, but I'm not too fussed.
 
The counters are in the game exactly as you described, except you press forward and not back. It uses up 2/3 of your EX gauge, so you can't perform it until your EX gauge is at least 2/3 full.
 
i think xrays are fine, why the hell should something have to be difficult to pull off? Its not good for casual players and i thing having slightly more complexed moves in the game would slow down the game play for MK and it wouldnt work. SSF4 is a ***** sometimes for this when trying to pull the specials of many a time ive tried pulling of a metsu hadouken ultra or whatever its called only to do a dragon punch and get destroyed by some one online.
I think the simplicity of the controls on MK is one of the things i enjoy about the game compared to say street fighter i believe most people have a chance of winning or pulling something off thats satisfying and fun, where as at street fighter you either have to be very good and be constantly in practice or you stand no chance of winning. If you want deeper fighting play something else. MK is what it is and i ****ing love it
 
Parrying in SF3 requires some timing/execution, but the added strategic value is questionable. Parrying negates anything that is not a throw and it can done anywhere at any time. At least Alpha counters cost part of the super meter.
 
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Something to help when you are stuck in the corner, and some players, using characters with explicity frame advantage, just keeping with the pressure and ripping you apart with a lot of short combos, one after another, until you lose 70% of your health bar ..... maybe parry moves for anyone, or, improving a lot the wake-up attack once you are trapped in the corner .....
 
yautjared said:
Something to help when you are stuck in the corner, and some players, using characters with explicity frame advantage, just keeping with the pressure and ripping you apart with a lot of short combos, one after another, until you lose 70% of your health bar ..... maybe parry moves for anyone, or, improving a lot the wake-up attack once you are trapped in the corner .....
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Maybe give every character a universal parry move, that only works when they are at or near a corner. The commanded could be Down, Down, Down, 1 as none of the characters have specials that conflict with this input.
 
But in terms of something new and unique...Bring back multi layered arenas
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This is a great idea and after a lot of thought, the only idea I actually like. Multi-layered arenas allowed for more strategic combat (in the sense of MK vs DC when the falling while fighting thing was im implemented) and plus smashing your opponent through a wall and ending up somewhere else was kind of cool. With MK 9's amazing level design, adding some multi-layered levels almost seems like a no brainer, and in my opinion would add more depth.

make every character unique like size, speed, health, and damage wise
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This would be a very, very bad idea. Increasing damage while decreasing health, or vice versa for the sake of balance for each and every character is not only mind boggling, it completely defeats the purpose of trying to make a more balanced game. I think the characters are already subject to different styles of play, such as: Offensive, Defensive, and Technical. Changing anything else, from size to health or even to damage would make certain match ups increasingly unfair, as it's already hard enough for non-teleporting characters to handle their own against ones that can. This is the kind of game that rests on it's own laurels. Any game that has you bleed an unlimited amount of blood and has you tear own someone's spine and beat them to death with it doesn't really need a whole lot of depth. Just balance and good, solid fighting.

Something to help when you are stuck in the corner, and some players, using characters with explicity frame advantage, just keeping with the pressure and ripping you apart with a lot of short combos, one after another, until you lose 70% of your health bar ..... maybe parry moves for anyone, or, improving a lot the wake-up attack once you are trapped in the corner .....
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I think the multi-layered levels would help with that. If not, then maybe tweaking the wake up attacks would be a suggestion, but they seem fine as is, it just requires timing. I've never been stuck in that situation before (no pun intended) so I wouldn't know.
 
I would say give everyone about 3 or 4 more special based attacks that are completely new added to their existing move set and set the damage for the new moves all around the same (short combos included) - I think this would help give people more options and keep people on their toes. If each fighter had a few more moves then it be a bit less predictable.

give everyone the ability to dash cancel certain moves.( ex. Kabals dash cancel) - think about how you have to play against a good Kabal user- inf block string doesn't count- what if jax or reptile could xx their dash or scorpion could cancel/ retract his spear? ......indeed....

And make the meter bar 4 bars.
I say this cause it would prolong the match for two reasons. One is you get two breakers. I force a lot of people to use their breaker and then right after try to set them up for a punish combo or a combo into xray. Now if I had to bait them to use the breaker twice in a short amount of time then that's makes it that much harder and gives away some of my game plan .
Two is because it would take longer to build up xray. I think xray comes a bit two fast in this game. One extra bar would make it feel a bit more rewarding to me . Say if I'm kabal and I pull off a quick bait and set up then bnb at the start of a match, it seems that the other fighter already has xray . Most of the time ill pay attention, but sometimes it happens so fast and I get a wake up xray which brings our life bars to the same point, and this is like in the first 13 seconds of the match. But same goes for me. If I'm in a crunch, ill pressure someone on block just filling my meter to use my xray bar either as an attack/counter or, for mind games like "look, I got xray on deck" ...having to fill one more bar would just add a bit more thought into the offense and defense of meter



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What they should add/change in the next MK imo:

1. Chess footsies (they need to have less clunky movements and better/faster mid-range pokes)

2. Counter/parry univerval mechanic but that wouldn't be like TS but more of a guessing game (rock/paper/scissor kinda thing). F+1/3 to parry front normals and F+2/4 to parry back normals. FD+same to parry low attacks. I think this could add a layer of depth to mixups and mind games.

3. Make all "big" special moves incredibly unsafe on block. (to make sure scrubs can't get away with spamming random stuff). Especially moves with pop up or capture properties. But have weak specials like projectiles be safer on block (not punishable by full combos).

4. Greatly reduce the negative edge window to make it not screw up inputs.

5. Have only 1 button to tech grab so that throws aren't a 50/50.

6. Bring back Run mechanic instead of Dash.

7. Make sweeps faster and useful (give untechable knockdowns, set up a safe jump. Make sweeps counter Run attacks and overheads).

8. Make quick characters with greater mobility (dive kicks, teleports) have less stamina/health.

9. Make slow characters like Sheeva stronger and have more health/armored moves.

10. Make characters with poor combo options have more/better specials/pokes.

11. Make big combo characters inflict a lot less damage.

12. Include more fighting styles (wrestling, boxing, tae kwan do, samurai, monkey kung fu, drunken master, muay thai etc.)

13. Make footsies, grappler and 50/50 a playstyle.

14. Don't give everyone projectiles. But make zoning characters have effective/strong zoning tools and give characters with no projectile something to get around heavy zoners (super armor, slide type, teleport type or reflect type special move)

15. Make mixups universal (so give everyone a decent low and overhead attack)

16. For certain characters that have trouble in the corner/vs rushdown, include wall jumping and wall type related attacks. (maybe throws could be different in the corner or you could use a wall jump to perform a usually not airborne move for example)

17. All characters should have one special move they can charge up to 3 levels. And level 3 would be unblockable (kinda like Focus Attack).

18. All characters should be able to feint one of their specials (fake teleport, fake dash, fake projectile, fake slide, fake ground pound etc).

19. Bring back Friendships and Brutalities.

20. Add more fun stuff in the krypt (less 3D models and crappy concepts, more making of vids, funny images/clips, comics, stages/new weapons to unlock, mini games (bring back chess MK, puzzle kombat and Konquest Mode + more stuff) etc.


Those would be my suggestions if I worked with NRS on the brainstorm department. :) HIRE ME NRS I PROMISE I WILL MAKE YOUR GAMES BETTER. :twisted: lmao
 
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i like a lot of vulcan hades ideas. some not so much (would make sweeps TOO powerful imo, though some of the aspects you mentioned should be implemented.) id actually rather see sweeps be countered by overheads, overheads stuffed by reg pokes, and pokes stuffed by sweeps give a little rock paper scissors footwork.

adjusting health in relation to speed and such is tricky, i think its adjusting too much of the game too soon and wed lose what balance we have.

i actually think the run mechanic would be a bad idea for this game

wall jumps would be sweet though

id actually like throws to be a bit more useful imo. but i like throws :)

id actually like to see xrays removed/tweaked as right now some of them are just excuses for more damage while other ones have actual uses like reptiles (goes thru projectiles from fullscreen).

right now they just seem like a slightly cheesy mechanic, a cool one, but one that doesnt add much from the competitive aspect other then people being more careful if the opponent has full bars.
 
Timberwolf said:
The counters are in the game exactly as you described, except you press forward and not back. It uses up 2/3 of your EX gauge, so you can't perform it until your EX gauge is at least 2/3 full.
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I know how to do a breaker :p Anyway I said first hit only, unlike the breaker which can be done after a couple of hits. Probably what I should have said is a parry - that is more along the lines I was thinking.

Soul Calibur series had some good parries and deflects. Forward and Guard is like an offensive block, and Back and Guard deflected an impact off to the side.
 
^ Yeah I also like DOA's parry system. :)

aedanwolfe said:
i actually think the run mechanic would be a bad idea for this game
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Why? I'm not talking for MK9, I was thinking about future MK games.

Run could still be cancelled like dash into jump, dash attack, throw or block. All it would mean is you could travel faster and easier instead of pressing forward a million times. Of course I do think backdash should be replaced with a universal and reliable evasion manoeuver (backflip, wheel, roll, backstep, teleport etc).

I just think sweep could be more useful. Right now they serve very little purpose in MK9 because D3 and D4 are usually better to space rushdown. Uppercut, crouching attacks and specials are better anti-airs than sweep. Plus opponent can roll out anyway if you trip them. So that makes sweep a pretty useless attack right now. Not to mention a lot of characters have really slow sweeps.

In UMK3 the Run mechanic and jabs were a big thing so sweeps were actually useful back then. Sweep were used to stop run pressure and counter high jabs.
 
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i do agree that sweep you shouldnt be able to roll out of as well.

and character specific back dashes like flips and stuff i also agree with.

doa's counter system, i remember that, me and my friend got really good with it. had a match where we would counter the other persons counter with a counter (into infiniti) actually killed eachother with JUST counters, was pretty cool to watch though, we didnt even try to do it like that.
 
I don't like the idea of having different amount of health for each character. I do like the idea of improving the sweeps, I think they should be faster, and you can't roll out. Parries would be nice.

Vulcan Hades said:
17. All characters should have one special move they can charge up to 3 levels. And level 3 would be unblockable (kinda like Focus Attack).

18. All characters should be able to feint one of their specials (fake teleport, fake dash, fake projectile, fake slide, fake ground pound etc).
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I don't think all characters should have this. This type of thing should be exclusive for some characters, adding more variety, instead of being an universal mechanic.

Vulcan Hades said:
19. Bring back Friendships and Brutalities.

20. Add more fun stuff in the krypt (less 3D models and crappy concepts, more making of vids, funny images/clips, comics, stages/new weapons to unlock, mini games (bring back chess MK, puzzle kombat and Konquest Mode + more stuff) etc.
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On that we agree.
 
i want something like tekkens fighting style, like every fighter had like 20 combos in this game max, and some of them are just one button presses, but tekken literally had 167 combos for just ONE fighter, and there where literally over 20 characters in that game.


They need to add more pop up attacks

more combos that involve the characters personality *an example of that would be scorpions sword attack then a fire back flip kick, although its not a special it uses fire which is a big part of his personality *

more than two grapples *make some grapples more difficult to do like some of the fighters on tekken, but once you get them down they are VERY rewarding*

longer organized combos, i like the whole "make your own combos" but i like having more organized combos that have already been made, that with the huge attack list on tekken makes "making your own combos" so much more easier and a lot more creative and flashy
 
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