Is This Why???

Eks

Well-known member
So, we've seen a few characters from the new MK game, and we know it's going to have most/all of the characters from the first 3 games. The assumption with this Kollection is that it will include HD versions of the first 3 games, with all-new sprites and recreated arenas.

With these to thoughts in mind, it seems entirely possible that the fighters, costumes and arenas in the Kollection have been changed to mimic those in the new MK. (This is just a guess, mind you.) Palette swaps are no longer a necessity, so they have the technology to make them resemble their more unique MK (2011) counterparts. They can also make fully-3D arenas that mimic the ones in MK (2011).

If they were to reveal the Kollection before unveiling the new MK's full line-up, and if the above is the case, we'd quickly see that the revealed fighters look the same in both games, so we'd also know what the unrevealed characters are gonna look like, too. Same thing is true for the arenas.

Admittedly, this relies on the idea that NR is including all of the original 26 fighters, but that's pretty much the assumption already, isn't it? All of the revealed stages are from the original 3 games, so that makes this guess even more sensible. Certain enhancements in the new MK wouldn't be in the Kollection (like arena damage), but it still seems entirely doable and possible, and if that's what they're doing, revealing the Kollection would kinda ruin their efforts to keep unrevealed characters unrevealed.

This is kind of a wild-ass guess, but it seems possible. What do y'all think?
 
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What you're describing is basically a shittier looking MK9...lol.

The purpose of MK HD is to make the originals look better with HD graphics, not change them.

Just like the Street Fighter HD remake didn't add costumes from SF4.
 
The palette swapped ninjas in the 2D MKs was not just a matter of technology, but budget as well. Palette swapping was a way to add an addtional character without the use of additional actors or costumes. Add a few sessions of video-recording, some special effects, and change the color of the costume...presto, a new character. Even they do manage to acquire more actors and costumes, there is the trouble of making them matching the exact of movements (and hitboxes) of the orginal. That being said, I doubt it isn't much more than upscaling existing sprites.
 
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While this is possible, and I, too, had wondered if they might try this, I honestly hope they don't. We don't want "new" stuff, just better looking "old" stuff. To me, the palette swamping in the originals are part of the lore of Mortal Kombat 1, 2 and 3. To change that basically changes what is cherished by so many fans. Now if they wanted to do some alternate costumes as an extra; costumes that mimic those of later games, that would actually be kind of cool. But the old look and feel of the games should definitely stay intact.
 
What you're describing is basically a shittier looking MK9...lol.

The purpose of MK HD is to make the originals look better with HD graphics, not change them.

Just like the Street Fighter HD remake didn't add costumes from SF4.
I dunno how you think it would be a shittier version of the new MK game since it would retain the old games' gameplay and just look a lot like the new game. Mortal Kombat plays a LOT differently.

The last part is probably the biggest flaw in this idea. I also really doubt they're doing this, but ya never know.
The palette swapped ninjas in the 2D MKs was not just a matter of technology, but budget as well. Palette swapping was a way to add an addtional character without the use of additional actors or costumes. Add a few sessions of video-recording, some special effects, and change the color of the costume...presto, a new character. Even they do manage to acquire more actors and costumes, there is the trouble of making them matching the exact of movements (and hitboxes) of the orginal. That being said, I doubt it isn't much more than upscaling existing sprites.
They wouldn't need any more actors than they have in the original games. They could still have one person play as all of the ninjas. They'd just need different costume. Although, numerous costumes could drive the cost up too much, but who knows?

Ultimately, I can see them making this idea work if the actual body movements remain intact, too.
While this is possible, and I, too, had wondered if they might try this, I honestly hope they don't. We don't want "new" stuff, just better looking "old" stuff. To me, the palette swamping in the originals are part of the lore of Mortal Kombat 1, 2 and 3. To change that basically changes what is cherished by so many fans. Now if they wanted to do some alternate costumes as an extra; costumes that mimic those of later games, that would actually be kind of cool. But the old look and feel of the games should definitely stay intact.

I want them to retain their original atmosphere, too, but it's not impossible to change the costumes to mimic (not completely match) Mortal Kombat without changing the over-all feel of the games.
 
I hope they add new effects to the old games. Like Sub-Zero breathing cold air and more realistic body parts in umk3's fatalities.

Does anyone know how they're going to do the sub bosses? Are they going to use the same Goro, Kintaro, and Motaro figures to pose, or are they going to use new models?
 
Nobody knows much of anything, really. It's not been officially confirmed and no one with the right connections is saying anything on record. So the only things we know are what are in the rumormill and the only solid details are that there have been some HD reshoots of the 2D games, retailers have gotten release dates on their lists and the box art.
 
I hope they add new effects to the old games. Like Sub-Zero breathing cold air and more realistic body parts in umk3's fatalities.

Does anyone know how they're going to do the sub bosses? Are they going to use the same Goro, Kintaro, and Motaro figures to pose, or are they going to use new models?

I doubt the original clay models are of usable quality with the age they are. I know for a fact that Boon has said that the original Goro model fell apart from being posed so much and only the secondary model exists, which he has.

What I'd like to see for the HD kollection (aside from an XBOX release) would be; to have the blood redone, still over the top, but realistic in appearance. They should stray away from drawing it digitally or even creating it in a 3d environment and just green screen some actual FX blood effects.

Imagine if they created a prop for a fatality (Sub-Zero's) that was basically a neck wound, attached to a green head, that had real looking gore attached and could be pulled from a green dummy, with blood that actually flowed from both end of the wound. They could make it spray arterial like, and just pump out more of it. Then just attach the actors head to the prop digitally when you put the fatality together for a seamless, gruesome finisher. Now imagine them doing that for all the body parts we see removed throughout the first 3.5 games. They could even fabricate a few sprayers for misted blood and large gushers like an uppercut, glorious!

Also, lose the floating appendages from mk3/umk3 along with the non rotating heads.

Kicked up effects would be cool too, but the hit boxes and character movements better stay the same. It'd suck to have to learn a new game that only looks the same.
 
I dunno how you think it would be a shittier version of the new MK game since it would retain the old games' gameplay and just look a lot like the new game. Mortal Kombat plays a LOT differently.

Shittier version was from the perspective of the non MK Fanatics. It would just look like a watered down version of MK9 with worse graphics. Most casual gamers only seem to care how good a game looks which is stupid, but hey what can you do? I actually know people who think Black Ops sucks because the graphics weren't better than Modern Warfare 2.

I'm just looking at this from a business point of view, because as awesome as it would be, they can't make a game to appeal to JUST the die hard fans, it has to appeal to masses so they can make some money and not lose it.
 
@killkano:
I think the finishers is probably where this game could receive most of the improvements (esp. UMK3 with its over-the-top silliness :rolleyes:) since messing with that stuff shouldn't have a negative effect on the gameplay. Great idea with the green-screening stuff, too. I'd love that.

@docmighty:
I agree with some of that. It seems like the gameplay (which will have to remain technical) will likely drive off non-hardcore fans more than anything, but if it looks good, a lot more people are apt to play it. Although, I can see that merely updating the old sprites having the same effect on eye-candy fanatics.

I do wonder how the engines actually work with regards to the palette swapped characters. If the engine itself changes the colors, then they would almost have to stick with palette swapping since messing with the original engine might cause major problems. If each character is stored entirely separate, then they could easily do this. I also dunno if changing the finishers is even possible without changing the original coding, either. (Would be nice to get some completely new ones.)
 
I think the finishers is probably where this game could receive most of the improvements (esp. UMK3 with its over-the-top silliness :rolleyes:) since messing with that stuff shouldn't have a negative effect on the gameplay. Great idea with the green-screening stuff, too. I'd love that.

While the image of 3 skulls, 4 rib cages and 7 hands at the end of a Fatality was comical, to say the least, I honestly hope they leave that intact. Why? It's part of what made Mortal Kombat... well.... Mortal Kombat. Yeah, their trademark was a game both gruesome and violent, but it had a lighter side too (well, a sadistic, lighter side). To take this out would be equivilant (in my mind) to removing Santa Claus flying past the moon in The Pit, Dan Forden exclaiming, "TOASTY!" and Friendships and Babalities! Blasphemy!
 
Does anyone know how they're going to do the sub bosses? Are they going to use the same Goro, Kintaro, and Motaro figures to pose, or are they going to use new models?

With today technology, they can do awsome 3D models with the appropriate motion. But the final render won't look good if you have 2 D character sprites VS 3D model. Maybe by creating a 3D model and extracting 2D sprites from the 3D motion it could work.
 
While the image of 3 skulls, 4 rib cages and 7 hands at the end of a Fatality was comical, to say the least, I honestly hope they leave that intact. Why? It's part of what made Mortal Kombat... well.... Mortal Kombat. Yeah, their trademark was a game both gruesome and violent, but it had a lighter side too (well, a sadistic, lighter side). To take this out would be equivilant (in my mind) to removing Santa Claus flying past the moon in The Pit, Dan Forden exclaiming, "TOASTY!" and Friendships and Babalities! Blasphemy!

The extra parts were never funny, personally, because they kinda shat on the over-all feel of the game. I also believe most of the reason they did it is to stem controversy since they'd gotten so much flak from MKII. I guess I'd like the fatalities and animalities to be completely gross and dark (when they're supposed to, since some (Kabal's scream) fatalities were supposed to be funny) and the other stuff to be funny. I agree that it shouldn't be completely gritty, but they should separate the obviously funny and the gritty.

@Etryus
They probably will do that. It would've been completely possible for them to use 3D models instead of actors, really. I think they went the old-school route for tradition's sake.
 
The extra parts were never funny, personally, because they kinda shat on the over-all feel of the game. I also believe most of the reason they did it is to stem controversy since they'd gotten so much flak from MKII. I guess I'd like the fatalities and animalities to be completely gross and dark (when they're supposed to, since some (Kabal's scream) fatalities were supposed to be funny) and the other stuff to be funny. I agree that it shouldn't be completely gritty, but they should separate the obviously funny and the gritty.

@Etryus
They probably will do that. It would've been completely possible for them to use 3D models instead of actors, really. I think they went the old-school route for tradition's sake.

Ed and Co. have said before that part of the Mortal Kombat experience was that it didn't take itself too seriously. There were always inside jokes and little things here and there. Some fans seem to think Mortal Kombat should be the most dark and gritty game, when, that was never the actual intention. That's why I'm glad to see them bring back some of the lighter stuff.... it sticks with tradition and the original idea for the franchise.
 
I'm all for the comical aspect of the game. If I don't laugh at a fatality, it's not a good one. I just want it to be gruesomely funny. I'm not even saying remove the extra body parts from the game, just do up some of the areas better. Two Fatalities that comes to mind are; Jax' arm rip, where two of the SAME arm lie on the ground afterward, and Lao's body split, where the body is a mirror image and falls over itself on some sprites (Cage). I just feel like the blood could be WAY upgraded to an awe inducing level.
 
It's a good theory, but it's likely that another developer is making the MK Kollection, not NR. NetherRealm has enough already on its plate, where it doesn't have time with to go to that developer and share every character and arena that they finish.

Also, sharing of in-game assets from MK9 to MK Kollection as they're finished would not work out time-wise, or else MK Kollection would not be finished and released in the next few months - the Kollection would only be finished around the same time as MK or after. Only about a month more will NR be done putting stuff into MK9 (the rest of the time will be to finetune/QA the game and print discs). So if the Kollection were using MK9 levels and characters, they would only be able to get the last finished models and levels about now, which is way too late.

And the characters from MK9 are different size compared to MK1-3, so the hitboxes would be different. And they can't use the same move animations of MK9 because the moves and gameplay would be too different. Kitana's Fan Lift in MK9 is not the same lift at all as in MK2 or UMK3. So the developer would have to animate a MK2 fan lift and a UMK3 fan lift with that model from scratch. Animating 3d models takes a lot more time and money (manpower) than the easier, less-costly, and better-looking way of filming of the actors. To animate models for moves and fatalities for 3 games starting from last month or this month, will make the game come out June, July, or later.

Plus we already got semi-confirmation that actors were filmed for the Kollection. So, even if the Kollection were re-using only the 3d levels from MK9, digitized actors over 3d backgrounds would look bad.

And finally, it would look horrible and be bad press and sales for both games. We would look at a screenshot, and we wouldn't know which game we're looking at - the Kollection or MK9. Reviewers would look at it as lazy, and gamers would be much more likely to only buy one of them. To some gamers the Kollection would look like a better deal since it includes 3 games with the same graphics and proven good gameplay as 1 game with the same graphics, but different and new gameplay.
 
@kergon:
What Eks meant in the beggining was not using the 3D models from MK9 in the HD Kollection. I believe he meant really using digitalized actors, just with new costumes, which would resemble the MK9 new costumes, not be identical.
 
Wow. Most of that is so far removed from what I'm suggesting that it's not even worth addressing.

I will say that they're gonna use computer-generated arenas simply because that's the most efficient way to do it. The rest of it just makes it seem like you don't understand what they can actually do with games.

Thanks for the input, all the same.
 
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