Is MK2 really better than UMK3

Thanks!! The reason I have to give UMK3 credit is for the arenas. I like it and plus, most of the battles take place in the city in Earthrealm. They should've put some more city-type arenas in Armageddon.
 
Are you ****ing retarded? UMK3 gameplay is cheap & cheesey. I bet you like it more because all you can do is use Ermac's or either Smoke's corny combo. MK2 is better than MK3 in every way.

Hold on there buddy.
Before you make assumptions about people on here do some research, Shock is quite the MK veteran and knows what he's talking about.

I'm on the side of UMK3. I know a lot of people say that's where MK died, but I think it's awesome. MKTrilogy was even better. In a world of Street Fighters and King of Fighters with playable bosses and stupidly huge character rosters, this is what MK needed. And besides, as far as MK goes, MK2 was too hard.

Peer pressure is the main reason why everyone loves MK2. I know people who made that decision before even playing MK3. Same goes for the 'everyone hates armageddon' thing. Retro gaming is the new fashionable thing.
 
There is zero reasoning as to why MKII, MK4, or MKG are better than UMK3. You have to do better than "I like it more." which is all I'm seeing. The graphics and all that garbage are virtually indentical, you're getting into pixel comparisons. When it comes down to pure gameplay, UMK3 blows all other 2D MK games out of the water, and pound for pound, still more impressive than 3D MKs. They went overboard with features in 3D MK games, which in all honesty are 2.5D and not real 3D, they didn't test enough at all and wound up with games that have already died, while UMK3 reigns supreme and is the most played MK game right now. Once MK8 comes out, MKA will be completely forgotten, if it hasn't been already, and UMK3 will continue to be played.

MKII's lifespan on PS3 is shortening everyday, and it'll almost completely vanish within months, because MKII is just not fun for the majority of players. I have always said that if and when MKII comes out and is massively playable for people, that eyes will open and I see on every site. "MKII is just not as good as I remember." - phrases like that are common.

So take your fatalities, your musics, stages, character designs, and all that crap people fantasize about and remember, preferences for those types of things are wholly based upon opinion, and there's nothing mathematical or provable about which is better when it comes to aesthetics. When it comes to gameplay, you can define what is better, what is more balanced, what game harbors more competition, what game has more on the fly options. Saying MKII is better than UMK3 is like saying SF2 is better than SF3:3rd Strike.

As far as my ability, I can random select in MKII and UMK3 and beat you, using your best characters. I can guarantee this based simply upon how you type. If you say UMK3 is cheap and cheesey, then you probably don't know how to play any MK game. Go to youtube and search for EWAShock or Shock UMK3 and you will find plenty of UMK3 match videos, then and only then might you understand why I can say the things I do.
 
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There is zero reasoning as to why MKII, MK4, or MKG are better than UMK3. You have to do better than "I like it more." which is all I'm seeing. The graphics and all that garbage are virtually indentical, you're getting into pixel comparisons. When it comes down to pure gameplay, UMK3 blows all other 2D MK games out of the water, and pound for pound, still more impressive than 3D MKs. They went overboard with features in 3D MK games, which in all honesty are 2.5D and not real 3D, they didn't test enough at all and wound up with games that have already died, while UMK3 reigns supreme and is the most played MK game right now. Once MK8 comes out, MKA will be completely forgotten, if it hasn't been already, and UMK3 will continue to be played.

MKII's lifespan on PS3 is shortening everyday, and it'll almost completely vanish within months, because MKII is just not fun for the majority of players. I have always said that if and when MKII comes out and is massively playable for people, that eyes will open and I see on every site. "MKII is just not as good as I remember." - phrases like that are common.

So take your fatalities, your musics, stages, character designs, and all that crap people fantasize about and remember, preferences for those types of things are wholly based upon opinion, and there's nothing mathematical or provable about which is better when it comes to aesthetics. When it comes to gameplay, you can define what is better, what is more balanced, what game harbors more competition, what game has more on the fly options. Saying MKII is better than UMK3 is like saying SF2 is better than SF3:3rd Strike.

As far as my ability, I can random select in MKII and UMK3 and beat you, using your best characters. I can guarantee this based simply upon how you type. If you say UMK3 is cheap and cheesey, then you probably don't know how to play any MK game. Go to youtube and search for EWAShock or Shock UMK3 and you will find plenty of UMK3 match videos, then and only then might you understand why I can say the things I do.


I think even when this thread was first started MK2 and 3 were on Midway Arcade Treasures 2, which granted, isn't the best representation of either game, and does not include the extra balancing and features of UMK3. But after all that, MKers still went on to want MK2 more for their XBOX 360 and PS3 online joy. I think popular opinion formulates what is considered better, and for mine and most other MK players I know (all outside of this forum), MK2 is the Fashizzle and they still love it now.

What's a MKA? (J/K).
 
That's the thing, MKII is not so popular on PS3, not even remotely close to UMK3. There is an online ggs thread for Kaillera and PS3 online for MKII and Kaillera and XBL for UMK3, and the UMK3 thread is immeasurably more active than MKII. I don't think PS3 getting MKII had anything to do with people wanting it, it was more of picking the next most logical game since Xbox already got the most competitive 2D MK. MK4 probably would have been on PS3 had it been emulated by now.
 
That's the thing, MKII is not so popular on PS3, not even remotely close to UMK3. There is an online ggs thread for Kaillera and PS3 online for MKII and Kaillera and XBL for UMK3, and the UMK3 thread is immeasurably more active than MKII.

I think most of that is more of the number of people on XBL vs. PSN. If MKII was first released on XBL first and then UMK3 on the PS3, MKII would have the bigger numbers based on the fact more people are on XBL than the PSN.
 
It'll never ever see the popularity of UMK3. It has more to do with just the number of people. The numbers aren't even statistically similar on a pound for pound basis.
 
It will become abundantly clear once MKII is on PS3 how lame of a game it actually is. There are lot of people I know who will try it and be disappointed, because UMK3 is that much more of a game, which they already play.

MKII LAME? HA!:neutral:
 
Y'all should listen to Shock, he's been around forever and probably knows all there is to know about any of the MK games. He and his crew have dissected the games and destroyed the AI and each other.

UMK3 = best game play and most fun for multi-player.
  • Addition of Run button = faster play
  • Button Combos = more interesting play
  • Better ability to juggle
  • Using the vs codes adds more depth to play
MKII = Atmosphere (only if you like the darker, grittier feel)
  • New types of fatalities (Babality, Friendship)
  • Ambiance (Backgrounds, Music, Visceral effects)

They don't stack up against each other in playability.
 
Personally, and apparently I'm the minority opinion here, but I enjoyed Mortal Kombat Trilogy, the extension of UMK3, far more than MK2. I agree with all of you that MK2 did take it more seriously, and to be honest, that is exactly what I don't like about it. It is a difference of taste. I love Mortal Kombat because it is an intently over-the-top surreal fighting game parody. Or, at least it was as MK3 and MK4. Mortal Kombat Trilogy has a sense of cocky showmanship that takes the over-the-topness to a level that you can only get with cocky sarcasm and never with realism, in my honest opinion. The fatalities were far more flashy in MK3. MK2 fatalities were far bloodier, and I suspect that is why most fans like them more. In MK3 Stryker would jump over, strap on a bomb, jump back, plug his ears, then KABOOOM! In MK3 Smoke would let loose a barrage of bombs, then we see the entire world explode! In MK3 Sektor would bring out a huge claw and completely squish the opponent. In MK2, all you get is people split in half and heads ripped off. There is some sarcasm in the friendships, but nothing to the level of sarcasm of MK3. To me, a gory fatality is awesome, but a comical, gory, sarcastic one with showmanship if priceless. MK3 is the latter. MK3 also had far better digitizing of kombatants and arenas. I am not talking about style here, just technicals. The style, just like style in anything, can be debated endlessly. What I am talking about is technically the kombatants and arenas were clearer and had better frame rates. Also, personally, I like the style better too. More surreal, again. More showmanship. The storyline was also more expansive. MK2 was very, in my opinion too, simplistic with its storyline. MK3 is what broadened it and made it more accessible as a true mythology and not just a short story. MK3 is what started the story being more archetypal and legendary, and not simply like old karate movies which is as creative as MK1 and MK2 got with the story. I like UMK3 far better than MK3 and MKT far better than UMK3. MK3 was, unfortunately, still trying too hard for real and not surreal. UMK3, with its new backgrounds and larger story, really brought MK into being surreal. MKT, for me at least, gave it a sense of completeness. Why have every kombatant in the 2D series and leave out five? Raiden, Baraka, Goro, Johnny Cage, and Kintaro. Also, the four alternate kombatants gave the series a sense of completeness as well; as well as a glimpse into the nostalgic past; as did revitalizing the arenas from MK1 and MK2. I am far more a fan of MK3 than MK2. And my favorite version of MK3 is MKT. I prefer it for a more legendary story, better graphics, surreal atmosphere, and better showmanship in fatalities. And I prefer MKT for having all of this plus completeness and nostalgia. MKT is the best 2D MK, and I am talking the non N64 versions. MKT rocks, and that is my take on it all!

Yeah MKT (Mortal Kombat Trilogy) Is My Faveorite of the old ones
 
Man for those who think UMK3 is better than MK2 I must say I'm sad. MK2 is what redefined the MK game. It's the perfect amount of everything and when you get around to adding everything up in it you have the perfect game. The addition of animalities, and the run button ruined UMK3 for me.

Sure when I play online or arcade mode on it I use the run button a lot, it's a part of the game. However, do we see how long lasting of an effect it had since it died after MK4?

The run button ruined the games because it made it impossible for the player to win without using it and linked together the combos we see today which can go for more than 100% and because of that scare away any new players who weren't intimidated to try the game, but soon realized that it wasn't for them simply because they couldn't keep up with the players who had been playing it.

I mean that's just speculation on the overall gaming world and a quick observation on the common gamer who wants something that has the element of being able to pull off the upset against a better opponent. Which you rarely see in MK3 thanks to the fact that combos were involved. It's cool to watch but it can sometimes be ridiculous.

The playing field in MK2 was sooooo much more level thanks to the fact that people had time to recover from an uppercut... You have room for error. Where as in MK3 one mistake and you mine as well sit your controller down because a good player isn't letting you back into the fight.

MK2 on 360 would have more people playing it than UMK3 does thanks to the fact you're not going to get caught in a 100%+ combo and because of that a wider audience would be playing a more fair game.

Now, to pretty much give a counter argument to everything I just said...

I'm a die hard MK fan. Only die hard MK fans are good at UMK3. Simply because you have to be able to tolerate the game long enough to become decent at it. Only a die hard would be able to put up with it. So I love UMK3 because of that element that when you play online you can pick out who loves MK.

Still though, Mortal Kombat 2 is the greatest fighting game ever made.
 
"Man for those who think UMK3 is better than MK2 I must say I'm sad."

It makes me sad too, because they should KNOW it, thinking alone isn't enough.


"MK2 is what redefined the MK game."

MK2 redefined MK1, MK3 redfined MKII, UMK3 redfined MK3. Trilogy's gameplay was no different than UMK3, but they did add some untested characters.


"It's the perfect amount of everything and when you get around to adding everything up in it you have the perfect game."

It's not the perfect gameplay so it's not the perfect game.


"The addition of animalities, and the run button ruined UMK3 for me."

Animalities were a joke, people ASKED for them. The run button was a necessary addition to MK.

"Sure when I play online or arcade mode on it I use the run button a lot, it's a part of the game. However, do we see how long lasting of an effect it had since it died after MK4?"

There are more 2D MKs with run than without. One of the major complaints about the 3D MKs is the lack of dashing. Any fighting game worth playing has some sort of dash.

"The run button ruined the games because..."

No it didn't. Nothing you can possibly say after that can be true. Nothing. I love when people try to dissect gameplay when they don't know anything about it or what most people prefer. There is a small percentage of players who prefer games like SSF2T and MKII, very small, in the single digits, compared to the rest of the fighting game community.

"it made it impossible for the player to win without using it and linked together the combos we see today which can go for more than 100% and because of that scare away any new players who weren't intimidated to try the game, but soon realized that it wasn't for them simply because they couldn't keep up with the players who had been playing it."

HOLY CRAP. That doesn't even make sense! The run button was balanced even by MK3's release. In MK4 they broke the run button by not limiting usage after combos nearly as much. The properties of the run button actually make many combos impossible that would be had it not been. Now does that make sense? It does to me. The run button has very little to do with 100% combos and huge combos attract more players than they scare away. Essentially what you're saying is, MKII is for less skilled players and UMK3 was too much for them, so they stopped playing. It was too hard to play? When does the vast majority of MK players still play UMK3 over any other? I mean, even the 3D games die out after each new release. This is very backwards thinking on your part and you are basing it all off how you feel without bothering to do any research.

"I mean that's just speculation on the overall gaming world and a quick observation on the common gamer who wants something that has the element of being able to pull off the upset against a better opponent."

What you're saying here is, anyone should be able to win regardless of skill. So anyone can walk up to a grand master chess player and have the ability to walk away with an upset victory? The answer is no. These games have parameters that the best players feel out within a few months but over years the games are broken down to pure science. The more that is known about the mechanics of gameplay, the more games are played. Your opinion of the average gamer is really an opinion of just you. I myself have met hundreds of gamers in person and I know for a fact the vast majority do not like what you like, and I'm talking about fighting games in general. MKII doesn't have a significant fraction of the popularity UMK3 does in terms of gameplay and all the old school fans who loved MKII are the only ones who still love it.

"Which you rarely see in MK3 thanks to the fact that combos were involved. It's cool to watch but it can sometimes be ridiculous."

But why can't they learn combos too?

"The playing field in MK2 was sooooo much more level thanks to the fact that people had time to recover from an uppercut... You have room for error."

Actually, it's not, and you don't. MKII is far less balanced than UMK3. Understand that the top tier in MKII is a God tier, you have Mileena and Jax, who are the best characters in the game. Kitana, Liu Kang and Kung Lao are the next in line and virtually no other characters in the game are effective on high levels of gameplay, but even still those 3 are really no match for Jax and Mileena. In casuals you will of course find people random selecting, but that happens in UMK3 as well. In UMK3 there are many more overall usable characters and tournaments reveal many specialty players who bring even lower ranked characters to the top. This is something that wasn't seen in MKII tournaments. I say seen because MKII tournaments don't exist anymore.


"Where as in MK3 one mistake and you mine as well sit your controller down because a good player isn't letting you back into the fight."

There are far less usable infinites in UMK3 than virtually all fighting games. In UMK3 there are 3 universal infinites, and that's not 3 infinites every character can do, that's 3 infinites total, that can be done to every character. These infinites are Kung Lao's spin to juggle variations (who is ranked #3, not #1 due to tactics from 1 and 2 being able to defeat most Kung Lao players), Stryker's corner inf (who is ranked around #13 of 23, again that's halfway down the list and he has a universal infinite) and Shang's ground eruption infinite which you almost never see in gameplay at all (and he's ranked almost last). Reptile has an infinite he can do on some characters, but some of his variations are far too difficult to perform. So really when you think about it, if you are playing against Shang Tsung or Stryker and losing to their infinites, you aren't playing that well, and you might want to worry about Ermac's big combos even more than them.


"MK2 on 360 would have more people playing it than UMK3 does thanks to the fact you're not going to get caught in a 100%+ combo and because of that a wider audience would be playing a more fair game."

That's simply untrue. The average gamer doesn't want to play MKII because it isn't fun.

Now, to pretty much give a counter argument to everything I just said...

"I'm a die hard MK fan. Only die hard MK fans are good at UMK3. Simply because you have to be able to tolerate the game long enough to become decent at it. Only a die hard would be able to put up with it. So I love UMK3 because of that element that when you play online you can pick out who loves MK."

That's again backwards because die hard MK fans love MKII for the atmosphere, they are MK fans, not players. Most UMK3 players don't even like MK. Again, YOU can't tolerate UMK3 gameplay, and that is the minority's opinion.

"Still though, Mortal Kombat 2 is the greatest fighting game ever made."

Debatable.
 
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