Cassie Cage, her powers and the revenants.

[the_pathfinder]

I had this thought pop in. How would you feel if in MK11, Cassie is able to break the dark magic that's corrupting Raiden, Liu Kang, Kung Lao, Kitana etc. with her ancestral powers via an energy shockwave?

Her powers allowed her to scrub out Shinnok, plus on Twitter, Dominic Cianciolo himself let it slip that Sub Zero, Scorpion and Jax were cured by a shockwave that resulted from Raiden's powers clashing with Quan Chi's, not from the spell itself. So what if Cassie's green-energy-to-humble-the-gods created a radial burst of energy that knocks the corruption right out of the heroes and cures them.



...or do you think Cassie wouldn't give a rat's @$$ abouth her parents' old friends.

Just a random drunk thought, I had to spill it.

 

[kori_ryuu]

Well considering her powers are of an ancient group of warriors capable of challenging the gods themselves, I see no reason not to believe she could potentially free revenants in a similar fashion to what happened with Sub, Jax, and Hanzo. I would rather she didn't, at least with Liu Kang, Kitana, and Raiden, but yeah I can believe that theory could work.

As far as whether she would care to do it, it largely depends on their actions. If they did something like kill her parents or her friends parents (as a way to retire their characters for a bit) then I'd think she'd rather use that shockwave in a more lethal fashion. But, otherwise I don't see why she wouldn't want to help them if the opportunity arose.

 

[Ricochetmatt]

Will she care enough to devote her time to "fixing" them? Probably not. I can see Johnny maybe trying to do so, but not Cassie. She'd probably be more interested in keeping them at a safe distance and responding to any trouble they may cause. If the opportunity popped up and slapped her in the face, she'd probably go for it. But not seek it out.

 

[VerminatorX]

Her powers would not allow that imo. Reviving revenants requires powerful sorcery, like Quan Chi`s. Cassie`s and Johnny`s powers are just combat boosts, i think.

 

[mandead]

Surely it will be Shang Tsung who revives the revenants? He's clearly going to be one of the antagonists in MK11, but it's possible he may be able to carve out some sort of anti-hero role for himself. Who knows.

 

[VerminatorX]

DAMN! That would be cool if in MK11 good guys find Shang and somehow force him to help them, or maybe make an alliance against mutual foe.

 

[VonKrupt]

I don't think Liu Kang and Kitana are going to be turned back. I got the impression that in terms of plot role they were different from other revenants like Jax, and meant to stay this way.

For starters, Kitana is said in MKX story mode to be different from the other revenants in that Jax claims she's embracing the situation while Kitana replies "It suits me. I am a victim no longer". And Liu Kang, unlike the other revenants, has a legit reason to be antagonistic to Raiden (from his POV) in that he was groomed to be Earth's champion and in the end Raiden turned on him and caused his death. He always seems to make his case better than the strictly mind controlled Jax or Kung Lao.
They are also given more focus as revenants in that they take over Netherrealm from Quan Chi and are the ones to receive Shinnok's head and a warning from Raiden, going from mind controlled henchmen to leaders.

Secondly, they don't really have a strong motivation to go back. The other guys have their friends and family on the good side, but Kitana was one of Shao Kahn's assassins for ages, she wasn't pure evil but she was no cute little princess either. Her main reasons for joining the Earthrealm forces were 1) falling for Liu Kang and 2) being betrayed by Shao Kahn who created Mileena to replace her. Now both those reasons are gone, Liu Kang is with her, and Earthrealm isn't fighting an enemy of hers. As for Liu Kang, he only cared for the Shaolin and Kitana. He got mad at Raiden, so he no longer wants to fight for the Shaolin, and he's already with Kitana.
So while Jax's soul would be screaming inside to get back to his friends and home, Liu Kang and Kitana had no home to return to and were with the person they loved already.

Third, well, they are not needed. We have an excess of good fighters playable now. And we have an infinite pool to pick more if needed, from Bo'Rai Cho to Fujin, etc. We are however dangerously low on established characters serving as antagonists, which evil Liu Kang and Kitana do just fine.

 

[Commander]

Jax was just as evil and unrelenting to be good when he was under the same Quan Chi spell, though, so you really can't just suggest or imply that Liu Kang and Kitana are complacent with being evil.
For all we know, maybe if they DO get freed of the spell they'd still be mad at Raiden, but I highly doubt that Liu Kang on his own free will would WANT to continue Quan Chi / Shinnok's evil cause.
That sounded more like the spell / brainwashing speaking and less like Liu Kang himself.
Did you notice how Scorpion was also in the same boat and acting similar to Liu Kang in a vengeful way, yet when he was freed he just wanted to be Hanzo again and agreed to making peace with Sub-Zero, wanting nothing to do with Quan Chi?
The same thing happened to Jax.
Jax wanted nothing to do with that evil and went into hiding, living on a farm.
I don't know of any characters, aside from Quan Chi and Shinnok who willingly want to stay in the NetherRealm.
Even Sareena seemed to want to get away from the NetherRealm in MKX.

As for Kitana:
1 of her main reasons for joining EarthRealm wasn't so much for Shao Kahn's betrayal, but more for the fact that once her eyes were opened, she didn't want to see EarthRealm suffer the same fate as Edenia, at the hands of a tyrant.

Third, if someone like Shang Tsung comes back or Noob Saibot fights for the NetherRealm throne in MK11, we would have enough evil characters in the next game.
Last I checked, Kano, D'Vorah, Ermac and Reptile all survived and Sindel is also evil.

 

[VonKrupt]

Jax was just as evil and unrelenting to be good when he was under the same Quan Chi spell, though, so you really can't just suggest or imply that Liu Kang and Kitana are complacent with being evil.
For all we know, maybe if they DO get freed of the spell they'd still be mad at Raiden, but I highly doubt that Liu Kang on his own free will would WANT to continue Quan Chi / Shinnok's evil cause.
That sounded more like the spell / brainwashing speaking and less like Liu Kang himself.

Jax wanted nothing to do with that evil and went into hiding, living on a farm.
I don't know of any characters, aside from Quan Chi and Shinnok who willingly want to stay in the NetherRealm.
Even Sareena seemed to want to get away from the NetherRealm in MKX.

You seem to have missunderstood most of what I said. I didn't mean Liu Kang and Kitana wanted to be Quan Chi's slaves, nor did I mean they wouldn't act different if released from the revenant condition.
I meant that in terms of plot dynamics (not hard science with equations and proof) they are more adjustable to their current condition than someone like Jax.

They are with the person they love, and masters of their own fate, which is precisely what disillusioned, betrayed (again, from their POV, by Raiden and Shao Kahn) characters like them want. No longer receiving orders from anyone, with Quan Chi dead, they have freedom and each other and they can indulge on that more than someone like Jax, literally everything Jax liked was on the other side, he was a well adjusted guy with alive close loyal friends and a wife.
Also, I never said they wanted to be in Netherrealm. It's simple to see that, since they were just yesterday Shinnok's lieutenants and hostile to both Raiden and Kotal, they can't exactly buy a condo in Florida or Outworld. They are at present residents of Netherrealm and took over it, which doesn't mean they wouldn't move to Earth or Outworld when they get the chance.

It seems like you got all defensive because you want the plot to move in another direction, I'm just giving my opinion on how I interpreted Liu Kang and Kitana were building up to.

Did you notice how Scorpion was also in the same boat and acting similar to Liu Kang in a vengeful way, yet when he was freed he just wanted to be Hanzo again and agreed to making peace with Sub-Zero, wanting nothing to do with Quan Chi?

Have you played MKX story mode? He attacked Earthrealm's defenders into submission in order to get his personal revenge on Quan Chi, sacrificing the possibility of the revenants being freed and the valuable information to be gained, despite the requests of his former allies and closest friend/redeemer, Kenshi, whom he turned on. His lust for vengeance that defined him as a revenant still came to be when he was a human, and he still put it above those who were alive and cared for him.

 

[Commander]

You seem to have missunderstood most of what I said. I didn't mean Liu Kang and Kitana wanted to be Quan Chi's slaves, nor did I mean they wouldn't act different if released from the revenant condition.
I meant that in terms of plot dynamics (not hard science with equations and proof) they are more adjustable to their current condition than someone like Jax.

They are with the person they love, and masters of their own fate, which is precisely what disillusioned, betrayed (again, from their POV, by Raiden and Shao Kahn) characters like them want. No longer receiving orders from anyone, with Quan Chi dead, they have freedom and each other and they can indulge on that more than someone like Jax, literally everything Jax liked was on the other side, he was a well adjusted guy with alive close loyal friends and a wife.
Also, I never said they wanted to be in Netherrealm. It's simple to see that, since they were just yesterday Shinnok's lieutenants and hostile to both Raiden and Kotal, they can't exactly buy a condo in Florida or Outworld. They are at present residents of Netherrealm and took over it, which doesn't mean they wouldn't move to Earth or Outworld when they get the chance.

It seems like you got all defensive because you want the plot to move in another direction, I'm just giving my opinion on how I interpreted Liu Kang and Kitana were building up to.

I didn't misunderstand anything.
You flat-out said / implied that they wanted to stay that way:

For starters, Kitana is said in MKX story mode to be different from the other revenants in that Jax claims she's embracing the situation while Kitana replies "It suits me. I am a victim no longer". And Liu Kang, unlike the other revenants, has a legit reason to be antagonistic to Raiden (from his POV) in that he was groomed to be Earth's champion and in the end Raiden turned on him and caused his death. He always seems to make his case better than the strictly mind controlled Jax or Kung Lao.

Kitana wasn't embracing anything, as that was likely the brainwashing speaking.
The same goes for Liu Kang.
Since Quan Chi's brainwashing didn't wear off on them when he was killed then Sindel, Kung Lao, Kitana and Liu Kang could still under the spell, merely acting out on what they were told.
The feelings that they still have could just as very well be those feelings that Quan Chi brainwashed them with in his spell.
Quan Chi is dead, but the spell on Liu Kang, Kiatana and Kung Lao wasn't broken, which is my point.
They are residents of the NetherRealm by force.
The only way to free them was by having Quan Chi still alive.
Raiden even said so in the story mode.
Did YOU even play or pay attention to the MKX story mode?
Scorpion screwed any chance of Liu Kang, Kitana and Kung Lao being free of the spell when he decapitated Quan Chi.
Also, nowhere does it say in story mode that Jax had a wife before he became a revenant.
In fact, it's heavily hinted that Jax left the Special Forces after being freed of Quan Chi's control, then went out to find his own life.
He likely found his wife after those events.

Have you played MKX story mode? He attacked Earthrealm's defenders into submission in order to get his personal revenge on Quan Chi, sacrificing the possibility of the revenants being freed and the valuable information to be gained, despite the requests of his former allies and closest friend/redeemer, Kenshi, whom he turned on. His lust for vengeance that defined him as a revenant still came to be when he was a human, and he still put it above those who were alive and cared for him.

How about instead of replying in a douchey manner, you don't misinterpret my meaning.
He wanted nothing to do with being Quan Chi's servant or serving the NetherRealm.
Scorpion getting revenge on Quan Chi was what finally put his soul at peace.

 

[Nasty_Freak]

I can see Jade (possessed by the mysterious woman) doing something in that route instead.

 

[TehPredator]

I can see Jade (possessed by the mysterious woman) doing something in that route instead.

Why the hell would Jade want to revive any of those characters except for Kitana?

I cant see cassie reviving them. Raiden would do it, most likely. Why?

A. Raiden needs defenders for earthrealm. He's not evil, he will just protect earthrealm at all cost.

B. Some of the revenants are his greatest friends.

 

[VonKrupt]

I didn't misunderstand anything.

You did, because as usual you are in me vs world mode where every opinion is an attack on yours. You're the one who called me out on an opinion, not me.
Like I said before, I'm talking from a storytelling perspective. I'm not speaking about some hard fact on how Liu Kang or Kitana feel, I'm speaking about character arcs. Revenants and corrupted people, in fiction, are thematically about someone giving in to a bad feeling or aspect of themselves. In terms of plot, some characters are more open to these situations than others.
I'm not talking about a court case or science on what happened and will happen, you seem to think I am.

Scorpion was a classic fallen soul story because he lost everything he loved and gave in to vengeance, that is meaningful and follows a theme. Liu Kang and Kitana have similar internal conflicts that make them fit a fallen into darkness storyline. Jax doesn't.

What I'm saying is that Jax was a perfectly adjusted person, nothing was bothering him. Before Quan Chi took his soul, he liked his job and his friends and what he was doing and he was confortable in his role. When Quan Chi took him, it was randomly turning evil with no emotional arc or meaning. There was no internal conflict whatsoever. So either killing him or turning him back to good is what makes sense from a story perspective, as evil Jax has no depth beyond mind control.

Liu Kang, however, was a tragic figure who died in rage. He does have an internal conflict and a source of anger, because his perceived destiny as Earthrealm's champion took a tragic turn and he ended up not being allowed to fulfill his destiny and dying at the hands of his master and mentor, whom he cursed as he died.
He is a character with a background in terms of giving in to bad feelings, someone conflicted, someone in rage. Like Scorpion, Liu Kang makes perfect sense as a revenant giving in to his dark side.

My opinion, and again, opinion, is that it's likely NRS will explore this. I don't give a s**t about the mechanics of mind control and I'm not saying Liu Kang without revenant condition isn't a good guy. I'm merely arguing, in my opinion, the plot is building up for a meaningful evil Liu Kang development, that is nothing like Jax's because Liu Kang does have a trauma in his past before being revived.
It's my prediction and my interpretation. If you don't think Liu Kang makes more sense as a revenant, that's fine. It's OK if someone on the internet sees things differently, we don't need to argue until you convince me or wathever.

 

[Commander]

I went into what you call "me vs world" mode because you replied with a douchey / snide / snarky remark, asking if I played the game.
Why did you feel the need to go that route and start a fight?

Scorpion, Liu Kang and Kitana going through similar tragic events before they died are why I think that it's possible that Liu and Kitana could become good or neutral again and try to restore Edenia.
Scorpion wanted nothing to do with serving Quan Chi or serving the NetherRealm, due to the trauma that he suffered while serving Quan Chi.
Scorpion also felt remorse (temporarily) for killing Bi-Han, and Liu Kang seemed to have felt remorse / guilt after Raiden dropped Shinnok's head at the feet of he and Kitana.
I see more similarities between Hanzo and Liu Kang / Kitana, and I don't mind having differing opinions, but there's no reason to act as rudely as you did in your previous post.

 

[Kitty_55]

Why the hell would Jade want to revive any of those characters except for Kitana?

Because they're her allies as well.

I cant see cassie reviving them.

Of course you can't.

Raiden would do it, most likely. Why?

No, he wouldn't either.

He's not evil

Raiden has taken a darker route after cleansing the Jensei. And basically threatening Liu Kang and Kitana that he will basically kill anyone and anything that dares threaten Earthrealm. This could range from multiple different areas such as killing evil characters to good if they decided to make a move against Earthrealm.

I'd like to direct your attention to Raiden's ending in Deception. He brutally kills a good guy, Shujinko, because his actions threatened Earthrealm. This is what Raiden's sole purpose is now. He may not technically be evil, but if he slays someone that's good, then he does have evil tendencies within him.

So in a way, yes he is evil.

B. Some of the revenants are his greatest friends.

Then he should have instantly revived Liu Kang and Kitana, but look at X's ending. They're rulers of the Netherealm, clearly that tells us that Raiden has far greater intentions to be used somewhere else that's not reviving his fallen allies.

 

[p.W]

Scorpion, Liu Kang and Kitana going through similar tragic events before they died are why I think that it's possible that Liu and Kitana could become good or neutral again and try to restore Edenia.
Scorpion wanted nothing to do with serving Quan Chi or serving the NetherRealm, due to the trauma that he suffered while serving Quan Chi.

There's a fundamental difference between Scorpion and Kang/Kitana. Even after killing Scorpion, Quan Chi felt the need to lie to him to enlist him as a servant. From that, even without the elaboration provided by the comic, we must infer that souls in the Netherrealm are not all equally corruptible and do not all similarly give themselves up to Quan Chi.

But Kang and Kitana did. He didn't have to lie to them. I say that because 1) we didn't see him lying about a thing, and 2) he has no need to. Kang is legitimately angry at Raiden and Kitana is legitimately angry at the world (raised by the murderer of her family who kept her past hidden from her, cloned as soon as she was becoming too much trouble to bother keeping, murdered by a spectre of her own mother as soon as she tried to do the right thing).

So while I can absolutely see them going "neutral" in Quan Chi's absence, neutral in this case probably still means they're dicks. Especially Kang.

Scorpion also felt remorse (temporarily) for killing Bi-Han, and Liu Kang seemed to have felt remorse / guilt after Raiden dropped Shinnok's head at the feet of he and Kitana.

I didn't get any remorse/guilt out of that scene, just concern. "Oh crap we done goofed up."

Then he should have instantly revived Liu Kang and Kitana, but look at X's ending. They're rulers of the Netherealm, clearly that tells us that Raiden has far greater intentions to be used somewhere else that's not reviving his fallen allies.

As far as we know, Raiden has no means of resurrecting anyone now that Quan Chi is gone.

 

[Kitty_55]

Yeah, I kinda got the feeling from Scorpion too that he wasn't really sorry for murdering Bi Han. p.W nailed it to the kind of reaction I saw from him.

And yes, as of right now we don't know what other motives Raiden has other than being a huge protector for Earthrealm. He might have intentions to resurrect, but we don't know just yet.

The ending just showed me that since Kitana and Liu are still revenants, Raiden didn't do anything to change them back. They'll be dicks, I can see them being dicks to him.

 

[Jacqui Briggs]

I for one personally believe Kitana and Liu Kang actually enjoy being revenants. Unlike Hanzo, Kuai, Jax, Kung Lao,, and the others revenants. Both Kitana and Liu's revenants selves allows them to embrace their inner darkness. Even if they were turned back to their regulars selves in MK11. I have a strong feeling neither Kitana or Liu would go back to being heroes.

 

[the_pathfinder]

I for one personally believe Kitana and Liu Kang actually enjoy being revenants. Unlike Hanzo, Kuai, Jax, Kung Lao,, and the others revenants. Both Kitana and Liu's revenants selves allows them to embrace their inner darkness. Even if they were turned back to their regulars selves in MK11. I have a strong feeling neither Kitana or Liu would go back to being heroes.

There's no way they're going to stay villains for long. It's about the same as Hulk Hogan turning heel and joining the NWO back in the WCW Nitro days, it's all kayfabe, a gambit to freshen up the storylines of long standing characters. They may reside on evil street now, but check back after MK11 and they'll be elsewhere...Repentance Avenue. That's where thing are going to get real interesting. For instance, will the new heroes accept them back into their ranks when it's all said and done and they're somewhat back to normal? maybe...maybe not.

And as far as "enjoying" their revenant status, they have no choice but to enjoy it, Quan Chi not only resurrected them, he twisted their minds (as stated in Quan Chi's reveal trailer) and altered their perspective to drive them into darkness, so therefore they are not themselves at all, like when Green Lantern went evil for a while, or almost all the major DC heroes during the Darkest Night saga.

 

[Commander]

There's no way they're going to stay villains for long. It's about the same as Hulk Hogan turning heel and joining the NWO back in the WCW Nitro days, it's all kayfabe, a gambit to freshen up the storylines of long standing characters. They may reside on evil street now, but check back after MK11 and they'll be elsewhere...Repentance Avenue. That's where thing are going to get real interesting. For instance, will the new heroes accept them back into their ranks when it's all said and done and they're somewhat back to normal? maybe...maybe not.

And as far as "enjoying" their revenant status, they have no choice but to enjoy it, Quan Chi not only resurrected them, he twisted their minds (as stated in Quan Chi's reveal trailer) and altered their perspective to drive them into darkness, so therefore they are not themselves at all, like when Green Lantern went evil for a while, or almost all the major DC heroes during the Darkest Night saga.

Yes. Thank you.
You perfectly said what I was trying to get at all along.
Being brainwashed into being a certain way doesn't necessarily = being genuinely happy in that state.
There are many cases where kidnap victims are brainwashed into going along with the plan of their captors, but it doesn't mean that those victims wanted that fate.
I'm of the belief that if Liu and Kitana got a chance to be free (like Jax, Sub-Zero and Scorpion did), that they wouldn't want to purposely hurt their friends or EarthRealm.
They may be pissed off at Raiden, and with good reason, but wanting to destroy EarthRealm goes outside of what Liu and Kitana's personality have always been, and to me that seems to be more of the brainwash talk than anything else.
Quan Chi corrupted their souls and minds, and it doesn't seem to be THAT absurd of a behavior, given that it's coming from someone who's corrupted.