Election 2012 - The Thread

Freyith said:

Nope. I said nothing of the sort. You may want to re-read what I've said more carefully. But your response certainly lends the idea some credence.

Click to expand...

Okay then I guess that's just the way I interpret it. But really come on if this thread is going to work we have to agree to disagree and remember that everyone's opinion is valid. You can't just go around saying people are wearing "blinders" because of the candidate they support. It's immature and degrading.

Also the condescending tone isn't cute any more.

I'm not putting on blinders I actively searched for negative things. Which is how I came across more things I liked about his standings.

He also votes everytime against congress pay raises. I
Just can't see a greedy man with a hidden agenda actually say outloud that congress should get a pay cut (while he is a congressman)

And if he was such a bad guy why doesn't he just stoop to the rest of their levels to get votes. He preaches and tells things that could lose him votes because he really believes what he's saying will work.

Yes ive become excited about him, but I'm not running around on YouTube spamming Ron Paul 2012.

Obama also stated he'd pull troops out, but then changed his mind. He got all those military donations because of his platform for withdrawing troops, same way Ron Paul got his donations.

Why is it that Ron Paul feels more convincing that he'll do what he says? Probably because like I said, I feel he's the most honest guy running right now. I would bet my car that the second he's in office he'll do what he promised.

And no I'm not voting for him because of just that. I like sooo much about most of his platform and policies. Extreme? Perhaps, but my confidence lies that with Ron Paul being extreme in one direction and congress probably in the opposite. I expect some balance.

n9195v said:

Also the condescending tone isn't cute any more.

Click to expand...

Honestly, somepony had to say it.

n9195v said:

Okay then I guess that's just the way I interpret it. But really come on if this thread is going to work we have to agree to disagree and remember that everyone's opinion is valid. You can't just go around saying people are wearing "blinders" because of the candidate they support. It's immature and degrading.

Also the condescending tone isn't cute any more.

Click to expand...

Actually, sorry, but I can go around saying certain supporters of certain politicians have put blinders on. If you don't like that, sorry but that's too bad. I haven't said anyone's opinion is invalid; there's really no such thing as an 'invalid opinion', since everyone is entitled to an opinion. It's when people confuse opinions for facts that you get problems. I think you're simply mad that I don't agree with your stance, which is unfortunate. But I'm not out to convince you to vote for someone else, or to change your stance. I'm just saying what I think. So if you don't like that either, you might want to reconsider your participation in a thread like this. Politics isn't for the thin-skinned. You shouldn't confuse stern disagreement with condescension.

@Alex/Critical:

Let's clarify something, since I'm a bit exasperated with you twisting my words around (or misinterpreting them, either way); I haven't said Ron Paul is a bad guy, or evil, or Emperor Palpatine. What I have said however, is that he's just as guilty of elaborate political machinations in order to make himself look better than he is as other politicians, and if you don't want to acknowledge that...well, its your problem. There's no two ways around that.

Also, I don't understand what you mean about Obama and military votes/donations; the military has always been against a hasty retreat from Iraq and Afghanistan. They think we should be there longer. Also, Obama followed through with timetables to remove troops from Iraq. Maybe not as soon as extremists on the far-left wanted, but he kept his promise. Don't see what your problem is there.

Also, BBBLP, since you so consistently have a problem with what I have to say, feel free to report my posts, or if you don't want to see them, use the Ignore/block user function. But getting bent out of shape... No reason for it.

Freyith said:

Also, BBBLP, since you so consistently have a problem with what I have to say, feel free to report my posts, or if you don't want to see them, use the Ignore/block user function. But getting bent out of shape... No reason for it.

Click to expand...

Now wheres the fun in any of that

Alrighty, let's move along, no need for any of this, really. Just hug or something, make babies smile.

@Freyith so everyone's opinion is valid but when your opinion is supporting certain politicians you must have put blinders on?! Lol I see that as a contradiction. That's like me saying that everyone's opinion is valid but if you don't like this you must be deranged. But what ever life goes on.

I hope who ever wins doesn't go through with that pipe line. they voted on if the oil from that pipe line should stay in the states and more than 230 republicans voted for the oil to go anywhere I wish they wanted to keep it here.This election is huge I just hope that who ever gets elected does something about oil speculators.......

even if Freyith seems to be dick ridin Obama at any givin time, she has a point about Ron Paul though.
yeah I'd like him as much as the next guy, but I'm not gonna have my mind clouded by his innocent grandpa attitude and believe that everything will be super duper OK once he's office. He too is a politician and will do some of the things that they are known for just like the rest of them. But that being said, he still is someone that I like more than the others. And I respect people who actually look into things about a person, similar to what Critical limit does, but people who flock to one guy for no apparent reason other than their feelings, then thats a problem. Last time people had that mindset and clinged to one man, we got someone like obama. I'm just saying a major dissapointment is something that could possibly happen again. Lets not pretend like that cant happen.


but turning this into another Ron Paul discussion is rather pointless, as he is not going to win. But what else is new
(as most real discussion about the guy are only taken place on the internet half the time. They really dont like him I guess. Pity)

Don't get me wrong, Sky. In Obama's case, the famous phrase "Mistakes have been made" comes to mind. He's shown a disappointing amount of unwillingness to stand up to the GOP congress' bully tactics and obstructionism. But given the choices, I'd rather vote for Obama than any of the alternatives. At the very least has has some good ideas and people abroad respect him, which does good things for our credibility overseas.

If Obama does what he said he would do in the state of the union he would be one of the best presidents we ever had. But talk is cheap especially when its coming from Obama the man who always seems to compromise to an embarrassing extent when it comes to the most important issues. But we can always hope. If Obama did what he said 4 years ago there wouldn't be any need for the occupy movement going on right now.

Santorum is far too right for any independent voter, so if he wins the republican nomination, Obama would surely win. Romney is probably the only thing that could make this interesting.

I hate Santorum to pieces, as mentioned in other posts, he's seems like your typical cookie cutter conservative choice except on steroids., but theres this little bit of me that almost wants him to win out of morbid curiosity just to see how crazy this guy actually could be and how people would react and hate his guts. Still though, that does not need to happen.

n9195v said:

If Obama does what he said he would do in the state of the union he would be one of the best presidents we ever had. But talk is cheap especially when its coming from Obama the man who always seems to compromise to an embarrassing extent when it comes to the most important issues. But we can always hope. If Obama did what he said 4 years ago there wouldn't be any need for the occupy movement going on right now.

Click to expand...

Unfortunately (or fortunately, depending on how you look at it), compromises are how business gets done in government. It's not an autocracy and no president can just wave his or her hand and 'get things done'. That's the most frustrating thing about discussing politics sometimes; this almost universal idea that things will just get done if the President pushes enough. Unfortunately, with an obstructionist congress in place, that's rather difficult.

I do think Obama's health plan is largely a success though, and contrary to some talking points the GOP candidates have repeated off and on, the Congressional Budget Office has estimated it will actually save the government money over the long term and cost beneficiaries less. The U.S. has also produced more local energy in the last 3 years vs. before too. So progress has been made. But you can't undo 8 years of mismanagement in 3.

I personally don't think there's much any president or single politician can do that would satisfy the Occupy movement. That would require a concerted effort from every congressperson in office in order to completely re-write our finance laws. I've got news for anyone thinking someone like Romney (for instance) will make it better. He's not just the 1%, he's the 0.001%; he's worth $250 Million and has always looked out for No. 1 and his buddies.

I just linked proof to your claim. How am I ignoring facts?

Yes it IS my opinion that the things you have beef with are not big enough to deter my vote. That's how important ending the fed is to me.

That's how important freedom and choice is to me.

It's my opinion what weighs heavier.

Just like I'm sure the fact that obama supports NDAA isn't enough to deter your vote.

All Obama had to do was leave the bill on his desk and the Bush tax cuts would have expired. But he didn't do it.

Critical, why should I respond to anything you say anymore when you edit half your post before people can reply to it?

Also, reality check. You know and I know Ron Paul will not be one of the two people you can vote for in November short of a write-in. What will you do then?

Freyith said:

Critical, why should I respond to anything you say anymore when you edit half your post before people can reply to it?

Also, reality check. You know and I know Ron Paul will not be one of the two people you can vote for in November short of a write-in. What will you do then?

Click to expand...

I probably won't bother voting, but if I absolutely have to choose I'd rather Obama than santorum or Romney.

I hope he runs independent but thats unlikely.

I edited that stuff out because it was irrelevant to my point and the discussion it was a random tangent and if you saw it then you would agree.

But whatever I only edited out the BS. That didn't have relevance to the topic at hand. So go ahead and call me out for cleaning my mess I don't care anymore.

I've already discussed plans with a friend of mine and we are thinking of moving to Sweden.

I was calling you out on it because you said something that severely compromised your position, realized it, then deleted it, and wanted to pretend it didn't happen, apparently. Anyhow, nevermind that. What I can't understand though is how you can be so vocal about your candidate and then say "well, I might not even vote, lolz". That's mind-blowing, honestly.

Sweden is a 'socialist' country, dawg. Way to out-do yourself. 25% VAT is the price you'll pay for a relatively amazing standard of living. :laugh: I'd rather live in Norway or Finland though. They're less boring than the land of Saab.

Lol I'm only voting Ron Paul that's it. Not anyone else. To me the rest are going to be equally bad.

So if I can't get Ron to win I'm not gonna bother voting is all I'm saying. I was pretending I cant vote for him. For the sake of your question

Ron Paul would get absolutely nothing done if he gets elected. You think Obama didnt get anything done? Wait until our idiotic congress to meet Ron Paul. They will reject his ideas faster than you can say his name.

Congress can blow my load.
We should be able to impeach them.
Not that it would matter if we could though, nobody even knows what goes on in that ****ing MTV reality show reject house.